I'm dealing with a situation now - agent in the biz for just over a year - fully independent and simply does not like his agency - they do not return calls, provide any support, etc...
The agency will not release him - no reason given except "we don't sign releases." They never did provide the training they promised so he ended up self-training.
The kicker is he's as-earned and has been as-earned from the start so there is zero liability.
He's already expressed that one way or another he is simply not going to continue to put business through them - they are simply not doing anything to earn their override.
The mentality with these some of these agencies seems to be that of a psychotic boyfriend; "If I can't have you no one can."
I'm not sure the term "independent agent" means anything when most agents are anything but independent. I'm struggling to find out what "independent" actually means when 100% of all carriers and require a written release.
Release from what? We are we "released" from? We own and operate our own business. This is a bit like opening up a sub shot, signing with a lunch meat supplier who delivers poor service, then coming to find if you want another supplier you can't receive lunch meat for six months.
This is something that needs drastic change in our business. Agents need more in writing to protect them to at least give them a legal remedy.
Maybe training and support or other promises can be in writing. This way if an agency lures in unsuspecting agents under the false "oh...we provide excellent training" promise yet delivers nothing it "could" at least be taken to court.
As it stands now there is zero legal remedy - even for the agents who have the time and money - to get out of a contract.
By the way, this is not just about agencies. Go "direct" and try to obtain a release.
------------------------------------ Health Insurance Agents: Training, Support, Discounts, E&O for $440 www.ihiaa.com
I'm dealing with a situation now - agent in the biz for just over a year - fully independent and simply does not like his agency - they do not return calls, provide any support, etc...
The agency will not release him - no reason given except "we don't sign releases." They never did provide the training they promised so he ended up self-training.
The kicker is he's as-earned and has been as-earned from the start so there is zero liability.
He's already expressed that one way or another he is simply not going to continue to put business through them - they are simply not doing anything to earn their override.
The mentality with these some of these agencies seems to be that of a psychotic boyfriend; "If I can't have you no one can."
I'm not sure the term "independent agent" means anything when most agents are anything but independent. I'm struggling to find out what "independent" actually means when 100% of all carriers and require a written release.
Release from what? We are we "released" from? We own and operate our own business. This is a bit like opening up a sub shot, signing with a lunch meat supplier who delivers poor service, then coming to find if you want another supplier you can't receive lunch meat for six months.
This is something that needs drastic change in our business. Agents need more in writing to protect them to at least give them a legal remedy.
Maybe training and support or other promises can be in writing. This way if an agency lures in unsuspecting agents under the false "oh...we provide excellent training" promise yet delivers nothing it "could" at least be taken to court.
As it stands now there is zero legal remedy - even for the agents who have the time and money - to get out of a contract.
By the way, this is not just about agencies. Go "direct" and try to obtain a release.
I believe it is "release from contractual provisions". I am no lawyer, and I would expect you need the advice of a Commerical Law (business) attorney.
Contract terms continue indefinitely unless a termination is provided. Termination can be by date, cause, etc. When you sign a contract you are expected to honor it. Without a provision of release on your terms, the holder of the contract has you by the short hairs. - Ouch!
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To be truly independent, an agent should not be dependent on a government bureaucrat for contracts or commissions.
I'm dealing with a situation now - agent in the biz for just over a year - fully independent and simply does not like his agency - they do not return calls, provide any support, etc...
The agency will not release him - no reason given except "we don't sign releases." They never did provide the training they promised so he ended up self-training.
The kicker is he's as-earned and has been as-earned from the start so there is zero liability.
He's already expressed that one way or another he is simply not going to continue to put business through them - they are simply not doing anything to earn their override.
The mentality with these some of these agencies seems to be that of a psychotic boyfriend; "If I can't have you no one can."
I'm not sure the term "independent agent" means anything when most agents are anything but independent. I'm struggling to find out what "independent" actually means when 100% of all carriers and require a written release.
Release from what? We are we "released" from? We own and operate our own business. This is a bit like opening up a sub shot, signing with a lunch meat supplier who delivers poor service, then coming to find if you want another supplier you can't receive lunch meat for six months.
This is something that needs drastic change in our business. Agents need more in writing to protect them to at least give them a legal remedy.
Maybe training and support or other promises can be in writing. This way if an agency lures in unsuspecting agents under the false "oh...we provide excellent training" promise yet delivers nothing it "could" at least be taken to court.
As it stands now there is zero legal remedy - even for the agents who have the time and money - to get out of a contract.
By the way, this is not just about agencies. Go "direct" and try to obtain a release.
Do you mind sharing the carriers that he is writing through this agency.
I've never signed thru an agency to do health insurance, but just signed a guy on to my agency and, if what you say is true, he's mine for life. That's great news, you'll pry him from my cold dead hands healthagent.
The situation that you described regarding support is fairly common among the really good Life Insurance BGA's, in terms of technical service and contract commissions, guess I'm theirs for life?
I believe it is "release from contractual provisions". I am no lawyer, and I would expect you need the advice of a Commerical Law (business) attorney.
Contract terms continue indefinitely unless a termination is provided. Termination can be by date, cause, etc. When you sign a contract you are expected to honor it. Without a provision of release on your terms, the holder of the contract has you by the short hairs. - Ouch!
The is no contractual provision I have ever seen to be released without cause from any FMO. It's an agreement between FMO and insurance company to not reappoint without a release or a period of time not writing businesses.
It's a disgusting situtation where the independent agent has absolutely no rights. Any marketer that will not release upon request is a dishonest bastard (and as Frank would say, I'm holding back).
Rick
------------------------------------ ILIAA
Training, Community, Support, and Success Independent Life Insurance Agents Assn rick@iliaa.org
The is no contractual provision I have ever seen to be released without cause from any FMO. It's an agreement between FMO and insurance company to not reappoint without a release or a period of time not writing businesses.
It's a disgusting situtation where the independent agent has absolutely no rights. Any marketer that will not release upon request is a dishonest bastard (and as Frank would say, I'm holding back).
Rick
You have pointed out the flaw in the system, which I had since forgotten, putting it behind me (so to speak). My comment was for contracts in general. The so-called "release" is often referred to of a non-disclosed agreement, which I think is non-contractual. I still think we need the advice of a good commercial law attorney to give us a reading of the law regarding these FMO practices.
For fun I ran this past an attorney and with few exceptions if it's not in the contract it cannot be enforced.
A few issues:
1) You would need to sue and not a shot in hell any attorney takes it on contingency - you'll be paying upfront
2) What do you win if you win the suit? Tough. In order to sue you need to show damages of some kind so in theory it would be lost commissions. Anything you received would not matter since it would be eaten up by attorney fees
3) You would likely lose your appointment. You are appointed at the will of the carrier. No law says they have to keep you on
The only thing that might happen and it's a pretty big "might" is if the agency/carrier lost the suit it could result in the clause being put in future contracts
That's a lot of money and a lot of time to basically play Robin Hood. If you're not in small claims court you could be looking at 2, 3, 5 years of court - the carriers will bury you in a sea of postponements and motions.
Release from what? We are we "released" from? We own and operate our own business. This is a bit like opening up a sub shot, signing with a lunch meat supplier who delivers poor service, then coming to find if you want another supplier you can't receive lunch meat for six months.
Maybe oversimplified with the baloney purvayor... Much more like having a franchise agreement with SubHub (fictional company), then deciding that you will just turn it into a John'sSubs, and keep dealing with the baloney (sp)purveyor; not happening.
Actually the ins contracting is much more liberal than almost any other business or franchise type of operation. The six month inactivity clause offered by most companies, at least offers an out, eventually. There are creative ways around this restriction...
Think about the agency that does provide training and support as agreed. They nurture an agent to the point where they are skillful enough to be independent... does that mean they should forego the investment that they have made in time toward the productivity of the agent...? I am not defending unscrupulous agencies, but in the protection of some that are above board, affords the same treatment to those that are less than expected...
And all that helps you NOT...
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"A successful man is one who can lay a firm foundation with the bricks others have thrown at him." David Brinkley
Maybe oversimplified with the baloney purvayor... Much more like having a franchise agreement with SubHub (fictional company), then deciding that you will just turn it into a John'sSubs, and keep dealing with the baloney (sp)purveyor; not happening.
Actually the ins contracting is much more liberal than almost any other business or franchise type of operation. The six month inactivity clause offered by most companies, at least offers an out, eventually. There are creative ways around this restriction...
Think about the agency that does provide training and support as agreed. They nurture an agent to the point where they are skillful enough to be independent... does that mean they should forego the investment that they have made in time toward the productivity of the agent...? I am not defending unscrupulous agencies, but in the protection of some that are above board, affords the same treatment to those that are less than expected...
And all that helps you NOT...
And of course, the release information is in the contract that we as agents sign?
At least be honest about it and put it in writing.
Maybe oversimplified with the baloney purvayor... Much more like having a franchise agreement with SubHub (fictional company), then deciding that you will just turn it into a John'sSubs, and keep dealing with the baloney (sp)purveyor; not happening.
Actually the ins contracting is much more liberal than almost any other business or franchise type of operation. The six month inactivity clause offered by most companies, at least offers an out, eventually. There are creative ways around this restriction...
Think about the agency that does provide training and support as agreed. They nurture an agent to the point where they are skillful enough to be independent... does that mean they should forego the investment that they have made in time toward the productivity of the agent...? I am not defending unscrupulous agencies, but in the protection of some that are above board, affords the same treatment to those that are less than expected...
And all that helps you NOT...
First of all, Rick's statement above is right - the fact that it does not appear in print anywhere is illegal and deceptive.
And welcome to business. If you operate that sub shop you could have a supplier that bent over backwards for you - maybe taken you out to dinner a few times, gave you a lot of freebies.
However, another supplier comes in and offers a better deal guess what - it's business
Yeah, you can spend a lot of time training and supporting an agent and they can blow out for...well for any reason. Welcome to running a business. You're hiring independent contracts.
The truth is simple; when you treat agents right they stay. Far too many agencies are doing nothing to earn a single cent in overrides - zero training, zero support despite their pitch to agents.
One of the largest traps I've seen over the past months is the reduced commission in exchange for free leads.
I've never seen this work out to the agent's favor. In most cases the agent will give up 5%, get a few free leads however when the apps don't come rolling in they find that their leads of stopped.
Now they're stuck on reduced commission, no more free leads and no release.
If any agency wants to give a commission reduction in exchange for free leads here's what needs to be in writing:
1) How many free leads do you receive
2) What type of leads are they? Shared, telemarketed, do the leads come in real time?
3) How much production do I need to turn in to keep the free leads coming
4) If the free leads stop or the volume promised goes down over "X" period of time, does my commission get bumped up?
If you can't get this in writing, run to your nearest exit.
Also, you need to do some math. How about a promise of 20 shared leads per week and 15% instead of 20%.
Per $10,000 in business you're giving up $500. $500 into 20 leads is $25...pretty expensive shared leads.
Can anyone explain no release
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