Insurance Agent Forum

[Mr. Bill]

I have friends that recently came back from a business trip to China and said that the pollution is so bad in Shanghai that they needed one of those portable breathing devices (husband has asthma).

I read that Jim Rogers (he was George Soros' business partner, author of most recently, Investment Biker) is moving out of NYC and over to Singapore because he believe China is "where it's at" for the next 50 years, but is too polluted to live there.

There are numerous articles from around the world about how polluted it is in China, and there is a risk that some of the Olympic games are at risk.

And yet there are still those who wonder why we wouldn't sign the Kyoto Treaty.

I thought this part of the wikipedia post was quite interesting!

People's Republic of China
See also: [COLOR=#00ff00]Energy policy of China[/COLOR] In 2004 the total greenhouse gas emissions from the People's Republic of China were about 54% of the USA emissions.[COLOR=#ff0080][41][/COLOR] However, China is now building on average one coal-fired power plant every week, and plans to continue doing so for years.[COLOR=#ff0080][42][/COLOR][COLOR=#ff0080][43][/COLOR] Various predictions see China overtaking the US in total greenhouse emissions between late 2007 and 2010,[COLOR=#ff0080][44][/COLOR][COLOR=#ff0080][45][/COLOR][COLOR=#ff0080][46][/COLOR] and according to many other estimates, this already occurred in 2006.[COLOR=#ff0080][47][/COLOR][COLOR=#ff0080][48][/COLOR][COLOR=#ff0080][49][/COLOR]

The Chinese government insists that the gas emissions level of any given country is a multiplication of its per capita emission and its population. Because China has put into place [COLOR=#00ff00]population control measures[/COLOR] while maintaining low emissions per capita, it claims it should therefore in both of the above aspects be considered a contributor to the world's environment. In addition, the country's [COLOR=#00ff00]energy intensity[/COLOR] - measured as energy consumption per unit of GDP - was lowered by 47 per cent between 1991 and 2005; from 1950 to 2002, China’s carbon dioxide emissions from fossil sources accounted for only 9.33% of the global total in the same period, and in 2004, its per-capita emission of carbon dioxide from fossil sources was 3.65 tons, which is 87% of the world average and 33 per cent of that of [COLOR=#00ff00]Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development[/COLOR] countries.[COLOR=#ff0080][50][/COLOR]

In June of 2007, China unveiled a 62-page climate change plan and promised to put climate change at the heart of its energy policies but insisted that developed countries had an “unshirkable responsibility” to take the lead on cutting greenhouse gas emissions and that the "common but differentiated responsibility" principle, as agreed up in the [COLOR=#00ff00]UNFCCC[/COLOR] should be applied.[COLOR=#ff0080][51][/COLOR][COLOR=#ff0080][52][/COLOR]

In response to critics of the nation's energy policy, China responded that those criticisms were unjust[COLOR=#ff0080][53][/COLOR], while studies of [COLOR=#00ff00]carbon leakage[/COLOR] suggest that nearly a quarter of China's emissions result from exports for consumption by developed countries[COLOR=#ff0080][54][/COLOR].

[TXINSURANCE]

And yet there are still those who wonder why we wouldn't sign the Kyoto Treaty.

Because the treaty is complete garbage which unfairly penalized and treated the U.S. like the worlds biggest problem.

As long as cheap oil and cheap coal exist - it is a hard sell to get countries and people to get off of it, because economically it still makes a lot of sense.

The solution is bio mass, electric cars, alt fuels, and clean coal - but this is very expensive and many years off from today.

No need to panic about Global Warming , the world is not coming to an end, and we will not run out of resources over night. Supply, demand and innovation have always and will always evolve - how soon is another issue.

I am more concerned with China's water problems, over population, and government.

I have traveled extensively throughout China - and it is a booming country, that is still largely poor. They are not going to invade the U.S. and they are no current military threat either - this is rubbish. China is easily still 40 to 50 years behind the U.S. economy (or more) and technologically - it is no Japan by any means.

Chinas problems are largely just that - Chinas problems. Most will resolve or play out in time, China is well aware of the "issues" they are having and they have their plate full (mainly due to population).

And Global Warming is the biggest scam since I waited up all night for Geraldo to open up Al Capones safe to find empty beer bottles.

[salpro22]

They are not going to invade the U.S. and they are no current military threat either - this is rubbish. China is easily still 40 to 50 years behind the U.S. economy (or more) and technologically - it is no Japan by any means.

What two eastern countries have the majority of atomic weapons? Where are the majority of electronics made either than Japan? Anybody who says China isn't a threat hasn't been in the military within the last 4-6 years. I have nothing against the country, but when you take into account the potential they have, it would be ignorant to rule them out of the picture.

[Mr. Bill]

Yeah, we already did the whole "global warming" thread and I put it out there that what we really need to focus on is the pollution element, which clearly China is not.

It will be very interesting indeed to see what happens with the Olympics this year. I'm not planning on going, but the possibility that some games will not be played because of pollution is stunning.

[TXINSURANCE]

but when you take into account the potential they have, it would be ignorant to rule them out of the picture.

It would be ignorant to rule ANYONE out, agreed 100%... China has historically never been an aggressor - the people are not aggressive people, they are isolationists.

On a side note, when I traveled China - staying in some cities with 30 million+ people, although a lot of the cities look like a dump - it was probably the safest I have ever felt in my life.

The government clearly has a short leash on the people, no one messed with me or even scammed me - I had one lady RUN after me to give me my change which I forgot to take from her...

[arnguy]

Originally Posted by TXINSURANCE

It would be ignorant to rule ANYONE out, agreed 100%... China has historically never been an aggressor - the people are not aggressive people, they are isolationists.

On a side note, when I traveled China - staying in some cities with 30 million+ people, although a lot of the cities look like a dump - it was probably the safest I have ever felt in my life.

The government clearly has a short leash on the people, no one messed with me or even scammed me - I had one lady RUN after me to give me my change which I forgot to take from her...

Korea, 1950-1953! Who came to the aid of the North Korean forces and almost changed the tide of the war for some time?

[Winter]

Originally Posted by arnguy

Korea, 1950-1953! Who came to the aid of the North Korean forces and almost changed the tide of the war for some time?

Jane Fonda? No wait a minute. That was Viet Nam.

A few million Chinese troops here and a few million there and pretty soon they add up.

Winter

[James]

China is a worthy Regional Power, yet they have India to keep an eye on, soon it is expected India will have more people and a larger economy. Outside of that Region, I really can not see China being a driving force as a World Power. Oh, and that whole Japan and China thing has been a thorn in the side of China for some time now.