Cost Per Sale, Leadpod vs calling leads manually

dr954 · 05-21-2008, 07:18 PM

I have been using Leadpod now for 60 days. Results are not so good. I am wondering if anyone else has experienced the same. I am sending Leadpod shared internet leads from 2 sources they recommend. I am buying leads in Florida.

After adding the total cost of internet leads I send to Leadpod and the cost of all transfers, I have calculated the cost per sale, and cost per transfer.

March '08 - cost per sale= $451, cost per transfer= $94
April '08 - cost per sale= $315, cost per transfer= $59
May '08 - cost per sale $630, cost per transfer= $85

I think these numbers are horrible, and am on the fence about trying them for a little longer, or to stop using Leadpod's service.

In February 08, I called all shared leads myself and calculated my cost per sale to be $135.

For those of you that have calculated your cost per sale on shared internet leads, please post your averages. If you have tried Leadpod with success, let me know your numbers vs what they are if you called them on your own.

Thank you!

healthagent · 05-21-2008, 07:54 PM

Our numbers don't matter - sounds like you need to dump 'em.

somarco · 05-21-2008, 08:02 PM

If your cost per transfer is $60 - $90 then your closing ratio sucks.

You need to re-evaluate something

TXINSURANCE · 05-21-2008, 08:11 PM

I spent around $5000 with them this month so far.

I am severely upside down and here is why.

Apx 15 to 25% of the calls no one is on the line or it gets cut off. They did give me a nominal credit as I complained, they were fair about it.

Apx. 30 to 50% of leads will be uninsurable. They do screen for 9 conditions which catches some pregnant and diabetics - but they will never screen for RX or how we would screen.

Some classic transfers:

-On 8 RX for migraines
-Needs a new batter for their back??? (energizer bunny?)
-Needs a new fake eye
-Morbid obese
-RX, RX, RX and more RX

This will vary by your lead source.

The other issue is there is what I feel to be a lot of wasted leads. You can print out the report of "bad" leads online and a lot say "not interested" or "received too many calls" or "only wants email" - well that is BS in my world.

We called the "bad" leads (that were not marked uninsurable) and if you are GOOD you will get over those COMMON objections VERY easily.

So here is my situation...

-I am $5000 in the hole
-My production is DOWN over last month (doesn't justify the $5k)
-Extra several thousand in lead cost (you need a TON of leads for them to call)

So where is the advantage?

My agents hate LeadPod which is shocking, I thought they would love to take inbound calls all day - but remember these are NOT inbound calls they are outbound, turned back into an inbound.

Out of 100 leads:

25 calls dropped / dead air
35 uninsurable or complete jokers

40 leads left...

If you are a KILLER and get 1 of 4 (rare) you are looking at 10 apps out of 100 ($1100 in xfer fees plus leads). 1 in 6 or 1 in 10 the story gets worse real fast.

We are exploring other technology and likely going back to cheap hourly screeners using Al's dialer and a combination of cheaper efforts.

I don't see how this can work at this point.

healthagent · 05-21-2008, 08:14 PM

I, personally, have had none of those issues.

CHUMPS FROM OXFORD · 05-21-2008, 08:26 PM

"from 2 sources they recommend" Hmmm...

Maybe you should dump the lead companies that Leadpod recommends and pick two new ones. Although, that might not make a difference.

TXINSURANCE · 05-21-2008, 08:45 PM

Here is the big issue I left out...

They ONLY work NEW REAL TIME leads sent FROM THE LEAD COMPANY. I have a problem with this more than I though.

No one is going to get over objections and close the new (and expensive) leads like we do internally.

If I had an agent that received that amount of blow offs - they would be fired.

If they want to work my 14+ day old leads for $11 a transfer, that is a good deal (maybe). There are several big issues in my mind that are a problem:

1. Paying for a high amount of uninsurables, do to a light pre screen

2. Working only NEW expensive leads and take "NO" for an answer too easily compared to what you would do on your own.

I know we can do this internally cheaper.

I am sorry it took me $5000 to figure it out, but I don't see the numbers working for my operation.

I will say the technology is good, the online system is good, the email support is good (phone is really not a practical option with them). Reports are GREAT. Detailed bad lead reports are GREAT.

I really want this to work, but every time I run the numbers - it does not work out.

dmiller90 · 05-21-2008, 09:10 PM

Originally Posted by TXINSURANCE

I spent around $5000 with them this month so far.

I am severely upside down and here is why.

Apx 15 to 25% of the calls no one is on the line or it gets cut off. They did give me a nominal credit as I complained, they were fair about it.

Apx. 30 to 50% of leads will be uninsurable. They do screen for 9 conditions which catches some pregnant and diabetics - but they will never screen for RX or how we would screen.

Some classic transfers:

-On 8 RX for migraines
-Needs a new batter for their back??? (energizer bunny?)
-Needs a new fake eye
-Morbid obese
-RX, RX, RX and more RX

This will vary by your lead source.

The other issue is there is what I feel to be a lot of wasted leads. You can print out the report of "bad" leads online and a lot say "not interested" or "received too many calls" or "only wants email" - well that is BS in my world.

We called the "bad" leads (that were not marked uninsurable) and if you are GOOD you will get over those COMMON objections VERY easily.

So here is my situation...

-I am $5000 in the hole
-My production is DOWN over last month (doesn't justify the $5k)
-Extra several thousand in lead cost (you need a TON of leads for them to call)

So where is the advantage?

My agents hate LeadPod which is shocking, I thought they would love to take inbound calls all day - but remember these are NOT inbound calls they are outbound, turned back into an inbound.

Out of 100 leads:

25 calls dropped / dead air
35 uninsurable or complete jokers

40 leads left...

If you are a KILLER and get 1 of 4 (rare) you are looking at 10 apps out of 100 ($1100 in xfer fees plus leads). 1 in 6 or 1 in 10 the story gets worse real fast.

We are exploring other technology and likely going back to cheap hourly screeners using Al's dialer and a combination of cheaper efforts.

I don't see how this can work at this point.

10 apps X 3000.00 Annual 20% commission =$6000.00-1100.00 (xfer fees and Leads)=$4900.00 whats so wrong with that?

I have never had that bad of Transfer results, it all boils down to the Lead Source,

tryan326 · 05-21-2008, 09:12 PM

Originally Posted by TXINSURANCE

Here is the big issue I left out...

They ONLY work NEW REAL TIME leads sent FROM THE LEAD COMPANY. I have a problem with this more than I though.

No one is going to get over objections and close the new (and expensive) leads like we do internally.

If I had an agent that received that amount of blow offs - they would be fired.

If they want to work my 14+ day old leads for $11 a transfer, that is a good deal (maybe). There are several big issues in my mind that are a problem:

1. Paying for a high amount of uninsurables, do to a light pre screen

2. Working only NEW expensive leads and take "NO" for an answer too easily compared to what you would do on your own.

I know we can do this internally cheaper.

I am sorry it took me $5000 to figure it out, but I don't see the numbers working for my operation.

I will say the technology is good, the online system is good, the email support is good (phone is really not a practical option with them). Reports are GREAT. Detailed bad lead reports are GREAT.

I really want this to work, but every time I run the numbers - it does not work out.

In all fairness their job isn't to prescreen its to get clients on the phone for you. You should be prescreening yourself. Maybe you might want to look at the lead sources your putting into it. Then again if your ROI sucks then its time to try something different.

healthagent · 05-21-2008, 09:31 PM

30 to 50% of the leads being uninsurable is a huge issue.

TXINSURANCE · 05-21-2008, 09:35 PM

30 to 50% of the leads being uninsurable is a huge issue.

They pass the Leadpod pre screen but usually have a ton of RX you know how individual is - if you farted in the last 10 years.

Loading thousands of highly pre screened real time leads to the pod is big bucks, for their operator to get "I am not interested" and move on where we would have overcome that.

At this point I am calling those one more time (manually) and verifying and we are getting over the blow off very easily.

I know you will never outsource screeners to be as good as you but when you add up the cost we are talking big bucks per application.

healthagent · 05-21-2008, 09:55 PM

I my normal lead sources (YOURS being one of them) I rarely find uninsurables.

Alsky · 05-21-2008, 10:30 PM

Originally Posted by TXINSURANCE

We are exploring other technology and likely going back to cheap hourly screeners using Al's dialer and a combination of cheaper efforts.

We would love to have you and your crew back Joe. You are a real pleasure to work with.

TXINSURANCE · 05-21-2008, 11:00 PM

I my normal lead sources (YOURS being one of them) I rarely find uninsurables.

We send the uninsurables to prospectzone :-)

We would love to have you and your crew back Joe. You are a real pleasure to work with.

Thanks. I think we can use your dialer and do better screening, and more cost effective with your system then Leadpod. I backed off your system while I was playing with the pod - but for my type of operation, the pod is not a match.

I am confident from a ROI stand point and a $9/hr employee I can do better on the cost side with your dialer then the pod.

That being the case - John brings up a good point about lead source. I loaded 4 different sources over time and two are so bad you can not even use for this (in my opinion) , the other two limped along. John is correct the source of lead is critical.

Hey what can I say a $5000 experiment? Wasn't the first time. Won't be the last time.

I do think the Pod is a good fit for some and customer service and tech wise I have nothing but good things to say about them. Financially I can not get it to work, this doesn't mean it won't work for you of course.

dmiller90 · 05-22-2008, 09:05 AM

Originally Posted by TXINSURANCE

We send the uninsurables to prospectzone :-)

Thanks. I think we can use your dialer and do better screening, and more cost effective with your system then Leadpod. I backed off your system while I was playing with the pod - but for my type of operation, the pod is not a match.

I am confident from a ROI stand point and a $9/hr employee I can do better on the cost side with your dialer then the pod.

That being the case - John brings up a good point about lead source. I loaded 4 different sources over time and two are so bad you can not even use for this (in my opinion) , the other two limped along. John is correct the source of lead is critical.

Hey what can I say a $5000 experiment? Wasn't the first time. Won't be the last time.

I do think the Pod is a good fit for some and customer service and tech wise I have nothing but good things to say about them. Financially I can not get it to work, this doesn't mean it won't work for you of course.

I would agree with you, with your size of operation, I doubt it very seriously if it will work for you, Plus if your trying to load it with volume and get the quality transfers, it just doesnt work that way.

dr954 · 05-22-2008, 09:49 AM

Originally Posted by somarco

If your cost per transfer is $60 - $90 then your closing ratio sucks.

You need to re-evaluate something

My closing ratio is 20-25% of all transfers that are sent to me, using web conferencing and selling over the phone. The problem is, Leadpod sends an average of 3-4 transfers per day. I have to supply Leadpod with 20-30 leads daily, and they can only transfer 3-4. I need at least 10! I am not sure why they can not connect with more people, its obviously the lead sources and the wasting of leads by Leadpod's CSR's. Many leads can be sold that the CSR's simply mark not interested because they can not overcome an objection.

It does not seem that anyone has answered my question yet. For agents that call shared internet leads themselves, has anyone determined their cost per sale?

Thank you

CHUMPS FROM OXFORD · 05-22-2008, 10:06 AM

"For agents that call shared internet leads themselves, has anyone determined their cost per sale?

Yes. A few people have posted their results. Costs vary between $80-$180.

dr954 · 05-22-2008, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by CHUMPS FROM OXFORD

Yes. A few people have posted their results. Costs vary between $80-$180.

That seems about right.. Thank you.

dmiller90 · 05-22-2008, 10:15 AM

Originally Posted by dr954

My closing ratio is 20-25% of all transfers that are sent to me, using web conferencing and selling over the phone. The problem is, Leadpod sends an average of 3-4 transfers per day. I have to supply Leadpod with 20-30 leads daily, and they can only transfer 3-4. I need at least 10! I am not sure why they can not connect with more people, its obviously the lead sources and the wasting of leads by Leadpod's CSR's. Many leads can be sold that the CSR's simply mark not interested because they can not overcome an objection.

It does not seem that anyone has answered my question yet. For agents that call shared internet leads themselves, has anyone determined their cost per sale?

Thank you

its obviously the lead sources and the wasting of leads by Leadpod's CSR's.

Once again, You should not have to provide that many leads a day, Its obviously your lead source. JUNK in JUNK OUT. Its not the CSR's job to overcome and push transfers, then all that will result in, is people that really are not serious in talking to you.

TXINSURANCE · 05-22-2008, 11:04 AM

Yes. A few people have posted their results. Costs vary between $80-$180.

I assume this does not include lead cost or does?

Yes DMILLER I agree with your assessment. I do think there is a place for LeadPod - probably not with my setup though.