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Old 08-28-2016, 02:29 AM   #11
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Long Term Disability Re: Long Term Disability
Originally Posted by scagnt83 View Post
Ive never covered an insurance agent other than myself. So you certainly have more experience with this occupation given your position.

I am not saying using a SS is the "best" way to go. All I am saying is that I have had multiple white collar clients come back different than usual with Guardian because of "non-standard" job duties. Perhaps I was a bit drastic at first saying to just discount the usual suspects and go with Assurity. But I am always super conservative when setting expectations for a DI policy.
I follow that the old maxim: "wildly overpromise and massively underdeliver" normally works best in these random quoting situations...I think that it goes something like that.

Seriously, I agree with what you're saying but 1) Guardian is awesome but can be tough...although in this case it is unlikely that they would be and 2) SS offset sucks unless you're a truck driver unloading your cargo (and even then it is still not preferable but likely all that you're going to get).

Out of the carriers that OP listed, Illinois Mutual would be his only option for pure base, although I wouldn't insure an agent with any of those products.
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Old 09-01-2016, 09:25 PM   #12
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Long Term Disability
Originally Posted by SPUR CITY View Post
GREAT feedback!

I listed the carriers above because those are some other ones that I already have in my bag. Granted, I'm obviously not a DI specialist. I'm a FE specialist.

I'd like to get paid on my own case, so who has a NICE FAT Guardian contract?
Call your local Guardian brokerage director. They're not going to offer you much on a one off but it's worth a shot.

Comp on DI is mainly in the renewals and for most carriers, will require consistent production.
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Old 09-02-2016, 07:57 AM   #13
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Long Term Disability Re: Long Term Disability
Originally Posted by SPUR CITY View Post
GREAT feedback!


I listed the carriers above because those are some other ones that I already have in my bag. Granted, I'm obviously not a DI specialist. I'm a FE specialist.


I'd like to get paid on my own case, so who has a NICE FAT Guardian contract?
Unfortunately Guardian and other big mutuals like them do not have a huge amount of room on contracts.

Most IMOs do not offer Guardian because their cut is very minimal. Many actually put agents below street because they are not willing to sell anything for less than a 10% cut.

Street for Guardian DI is 50%. You can always ask... but they almost never give out higher contracts for "one offs". You need to bring them at least $30k - $40k in premiums to get a bump of any kind.


Like Ray said, DI is all about the renewals. Clients usually keep policies for at least 15-20 years. Renewals can be as high as 20% over the first 10-15 years (depending on the carrier).


Unfortunately the major white collar players in the DI world are not very flexible on comp. Nothing like what its like in the Life Insurance world. With Life we can almost always find a higher contract somewhere if we look hard enough.


You could always find an agent who is at a higher comp rate and have them 1099 you part of the comp if they are willing. But there are not a lot of agents out there with their top DI contract. If you just dont want to get contracted I will 1099 you a % of it but I do not have their top contract. They do eApps for DI. Id bet that Ray or someone else would be happy to 1099 you part of it too.

But Guardian has a good product lineup so it might be worth getting contracted yourself. I know of a few FE guys that use them for small FU WL policies. Especially on kids.

Just make sure you have someone to help with deciding on the various riders. Of course you could always just ask us here on the forum.

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Originally Posted by Tahoe Ray View Post
Seriously, I agree with what you're saying but 1) Guardian is awesome but can be tough...although in this case it is unlikely that they would be and 2) SS offset sucks unless you're a truck driver unloading your cargo (and even then it is still not preferable but likely all that you're going to get).

Out of the carriers that OP listed, Illinois Mutual would be his only option for pure base, although I wouldn't insure an agent with any of those products.
Of course I agree. The reason I put that out there is a case I had a few years back that I tried to run through Guardian. Door to door salesman who did MAD volume. I was told that he sees 3x the amount of people per day vs. an average d2d salesman. Because of that he was looking at being rated or even a possible decline.

Of course their occupation questions might be a bit different if you say someone is an agent vs. when you tell them they are a d2d salesman.
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Old 10-01-2016, 03:06 PM   #14
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Long Term Disability Re: Long Term Disability
Do a spreadsheet with all plans listed. I would bet that Standard will stand out more than anyone.
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Old 10-01-2016, 08:55 PM   #15
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Long Term Disability Re: Long Term Disability
Originally Posted by scagnt83 View Post
there is a case I had a few years back that I tried to run through Guardian. Door to door salesman who did MAD volume. I was told that he sees 3x the amount of people per day vs. an average d2d salesman.
Do you remember how many people they said the average D2D salesman sees per day?

I've been banging on doors since 2003, just curious to see where I'm standing!
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Old 10-01-2016, 09:49 PM   #16
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Long Term Disability
Originally Posted by thomasm View Post

Do you remember how many people they said the average D2D salesman sees per day?

I've been banging on doors since 2003, just curious to see where I'm standing!
Insurance agents are insurance agents for the most part.

Your classification is based on income, years in the business, and certifications.

There are several companies that won't yank you around like this... (several relative to the thin market of DI carriers.)
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Old 08-01-2017, 01:14 PM   #17
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Long Term Disability Re: Long Term Disability SPUR CITY is the thread starter for: Long Term Disability

Originally Posted by scagnt83 View Post
I disagree with the other guys.

Go with Assurity as your top pick. If you have issues getting approved with them, then go with MoO.

As an FE producer you are walking around door to door all day walking through random yards and going into random houses and driving a good bit too.. This would be considered a risk class similar to a blue collar job. So the carriers you are looking at are most likely the correct ones considering your job risk.


I like Assurity's product because they have strong features and it usually prices out lower than MoO in my experience. They also have an excellent history of rate stability if you go with a Guaranteed Renewable policy vs. a Non-Cancellable policy. (which saves you some money and allows you to increase benefits on other riders)


Assurity also has some ancillary Riders that you can add on such as CI or Hospital Indemnity. MoO does as well, but Assurities seem to be more competitive in my experience.


Get Assurity with as much coverage as you qualify for (or want/need). Then add these Riders for sure:
- Own-Occ (your own occupation vs. just any occupation)
- Residual Disability Rider
- Future Increase Rider
- COLA Rider if you are under 50 and have a "to age 65" policy


If I remember correctly you are a pretty high producer... so Assurity might not offer you as much coverage as you need. You will need to go with Lloyds of London to supplement your Assurity coverage. You might even want to consider them if you do not like being limited to a 5 year period for the Own-Occ (as Assurity does). You access Lloyds via Petersen Int or a few other various Cover Holders. As a business owner, if you have overhead you need to cover you can use a BOE policy to cover those expenses.


The other carriers such as Guardian, Ameritas, or Principle do have stronger policies that have better features and more specific language for their definition of disability. But I have a feeling given your job description that you might have issues getting approved with those carriers, or you would get approved at a poor occupation class or with a flat extra.


FYI: Assurity now does own occ now till age 67 instead of 5 yrs.
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Old 08-02-2017, 02:38 PM   #18
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Long Term Disability Re: Long Term Disability
Originally Posted by SPUR CITY View Post
FYI: Assurity now does own occ now till age 67 instead of 5 yrs.
Good to know, thanks. Does that mean you went with Assurity? Did you check with others before them?
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Old 08-02-2017, 09:29 PM   #19
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Long Term Disability Re: Long Term Disability SPUR CITY is the thread starter for: Long Term Disability

Originally Posted by scagnt83 View Post
Good to know, thanks. Does that mean you went with Assurity? Did you check with others before them?

Yes, I went with Assurity. Doing the blood/urine next week. Thanks for your input on this.
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Old 08-03-2017, 11:34 PM   #20
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Long Term Disability Re: Long Term Disability
Originally Posted by SPUR CITY View Post
Yes, I went with Assurity. Doing the blood/urine next week. Thanks for your input on this.
No problem. Glad to hear your on your way to being insured!
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