For Those of You That Write Fraternals

[lgreen]

Just wanted to ask the agents that write Fraternals like KSKJ Life and Forrester's how do you explain what a Fraternal is? In my limited experience I have never run across an insured that knew that they could be asked to pay more money in addition to their regular premium. I know what the agents will say, oh it hasn't happened in 100 years or ever but you know what that is besides the point. The point is that they can. If it is a relatively new policy these are easy replacements.

In full disclosure I did sign up with KSKJ life a few months ago, have not submitted the 1st app with them. I don't know that I will. I sure wouldn't make them my #1 carrier due to their commission schedule like another poster on this forum has. I would find it interesting to hear how he does that buying leads and all? I know he will read this thread so maybe he will respond.

 

[Baseball7]

Best price, living benefits, wise UW critera...boom

 

[Newby]

Just wanted to ask the agents that write Fraternals like KSKJ Life and Forrester's how do you explain what a Fraternal is? In my limited experience I have never run across an insured that knew that they could be asked to pay more money in addition to their regular premium. I know what the agents will say, oh it hasn't happened in 100 years or ever but you know what that is besides the point. The point is that they can. If it is a relatively new policy these are easy replacements. In full disclosure I did sign up with KSKJ life a few months ago, have not submitted the 1st app with them. I don't know that I will. I sure wouldn't make them my #1 carrier due to their commission schedule like another poster on this forum has. I would find it interesting to hear how he does that buying leads and all? I know he will read this thread so maybe he will respond.

What exactly is your problem with them?

 

[jdeasy]

Just wanted to ask the agents that write Fraternals like KSKJ Life and Forrester's how do you explain what a Fraternal is? In my limited experience I have never run across an insured that knew that they could be asked to pay more money in addition to their regular premium. I know what the agents will say, oh it hasn't happened in 100 years or ever but you know what that is besides the point. The point is that they can. If it is a relatively new policy these are easy replacements.

In full disclosure I did sign up with KSKJ life a few months ago, have not submitted the 1st app with them. I don't know that I will. I sure wouldn't make them my #1 carrier due to their commission schedule like another poster on this forum has. I would find it interesting to hear how he does that buying leads and all? I know he will read this thread so maybe he will respond.

You make it sound like they don't pay well, they do. They aren't even my lowest commission company.

But let's just take one instance I had this week. since this guy was going to be stand with KSKJ the price was only about a dollar less than Trinity. I was thinking of putting him with Trinity. Then we ran across a med that would be a huge problem with Trinity but not with KSKJ. And I would have to do a phone interview with Trinity only to get declined or even worse, no answer at the POS. So I wrote him KSKJ. I'll make a whopping 10% less on one that's sure to be issued vs a maybe.

As for fraternals, I've actually gotten to a point of preferring to write non profits. But if a person is afraid of fraternals then they shouldn't write them. That's not a hard decision.

And there's something else, I never wrote GI because I couldn't get people a better deal than MOFO. But with KSKJ's modified I can. Not only can I get them a better plan than MOFO's GI, it's better priced than MOFO. I've written 3 of them in the last month. That's 3 that I would have sent to MOFO. I get 100% on those too. That more than makes up for the 10% commission difference on the others.

 

[WinoBlues]

Just wanted to ask the agents that write Fraternals like KSKJ Life and Forrester's how do you explain what a Fraternal is? In my limited experience I have never run across an insured that knew that they could be asked to pay more money in addition to their regular premium. I know what the agents will say, oh it hasn't happened in 100 years or ever but you know what that is besides the point. The point is that they can. If it is a relatively new policy these are easy replacements.

In full disclosure I did sign up with KSKJ life a few months ago, have not submitted the 1st app with them. I don't know that I will. I sure wouldn't make them my #1 carrier due to their commission schedule like another poster on this forum has. I would find it interesting to hear how he does that buying leads and all? I know he will read this thread so maybe he will respond.

I prefer to write policies. That "never happened" before sounds like what we we taught when UL first came out and we glossed over the guaranteed column.

I will write a Fraternal if there is a reason for a particular case. Last year a number of us wrote the NCSF GI to death. It spanked all the other GIs. So there was a reason to gamble on a fraternal. KSKJ's premium may be a reason if I am in a competitive position. Or if the client picks them. I many times show the FexQuotes sheets. I educate my clients and recommend what I do and they decide.

KSKJ is the company today. Last year it was X, next year it will be Y.

Make your own decision. No one else is going to cut you a check.

Oh and yeah, a year ago a recruiter would have been laughed off the forum at 100%. Us FU guys would love to get a consistent 100% on permanent products.

 

[Gooner]

My problems with Fraternals is exactly what the OP suggested. I've written 4 Forester policies and on 3 of them I've had agents come behind me and show them the 'maintenance of reserves' clause. They were weak agents and positioned it the wrong way by taking a negative approach and calling me a crook...all of my PI's showed them the door. The problem is I then got a phone call and had to re-explain what a fraternal is and why we went with them.

FWIW, I don't have this problem with RNA because when I write them, it's usually the lowest priced and the only company that will take them.

 

[WinoBlues]

Just wanted to ask the agents that write Fraternals like KSKJ Life and Forrester's how do you explain what a Fraternal is? In my limited experience I have never run across an insured that knew that they could be asked to pay more money in addition to their regular premium. I know what the agents will say, oh it hasn't happened in 100 years or ever but you know what that is besides the point. The point is that they can. If it is a relatively new policy these are easy replacements.

In full disclosure I did sign up with KSKJ life a few months ago, have not submitted the 1st app with them. I don't know that I will. I sure wouldn't make them my #1 carrier due to their commission schedule like another poster on this forum has. I would find it interesting to hear how he does that buying leads and all? I know he will read this thread so maybe he will respond.

I prefer to write policies. That "never happened" before sounds like what we we taught when UL first came out and we glossed over the guaranteed column.

I will write a Fraternal if there is a reason for a particular case. Last year a number of us wrote the NCSF GI to death. It spanked all the other GIs. So there was a reason to gamble on a fraternal. KSKJ's premium may be a reason if I am in a competitive position. Or if the client picks them. I many times show the FexQuotes sheets. I educate my clients and recommend what I do and they decide.

KSKJ is the company today. Last year it was X, next year it will be Y.

Make your own decision. No one else is going to cut you a check.

 

[lifeagent007]

You make it sound like they don't pay well, they do. They aren't even my lowest commission company.

But let's just take one instance I had this week. since this guy was going to be stand with KSKJ the price was only about a dollar less than Trinity. I was thinking of putting him with Trinity. Then we ran across a med that would be a huge problem with Trinity but not with KSKJ. And I would have to do a phone interview with Trinity only to get declined or even worse, no answer at the POS. So I wrote him KSKJ. I'll make a whopping 10% less on one that's sure to be issued vs a maybe.

As for fraternals, I've actually gotten to a point of preferring to write non profits. But if a person is afraid of fraternals then they shouldn't write them. That's not a hard decision.

And there's something else, I never wrote GI because I couldn't get people a better deal than MOFO. But with KSKJ's modified I can. Not only can I get them a better plan than MOFO's GI, it's better priced than MOFO. I've written 3 of them in the last month. That's 3 that I would have sent to MOFO. I get 100% on those too. That more than makes up for the 10% commission difference on the others.

Just so you guys know about Kskj, They do have good rates, But they do also make alot of mistakes. I have had several billing issues with them and a few policies that were set to them got lost. I confirmed the Fax on my end but they never input it in their system.

Also they take quite awhile to issue policies. Not that they are a bad company because I do write some business with them but they are small and make a lot of mistakes that I've never had happen with any other company. Just a heads up for all of you trying to jump on the Kskj band wagon.

Also a word from the wise, Make sure you never go with an up line with them unless you get a written release UPFRONT! I got a verbal agreement to release from an upline that now says they never agreed to release me. Kskj will not release my contract, ever! Talked to the VP of sales at kskj. In his own words "our contract doesn't have wording that we will allow you to switch uplines after 6 months of non production. The way I see it is if that upline helped you and trained you to sell final expense we should not release you ever."

My response was..... but they never wrote you for F.E. before I came onboard... Didnt know anything about your product and never tought me a thing about F.E. (anyway my mistake for trusting them to release)


Sorry for the rant but just wanted to give you guys a heads up.

 

[jdeasy]

Just so you guys know about Kskj, They do have good rates, But they do also make alot of mistakes. I have had several billing issues with them and a few policies that were set to them got lost. I confirmed the Fax on my end but they never input it in their system.

Also they take quite awhile to issue policies. Not that they are a bad company because I do write some business with them but they are small and make a lot of mistakes that I've never had happen with any other company. Just a heads up for all of you trying to jump on the Kskj band wagon.

Also a word from the wise, Make sure you never go with an up line with them unless you get a written release UPFRONT! I got a verbal agreement to release from an upline that now says they never agreed to release me. Kskj will not release my contract, ever! Talked to the VP of sales at kskj. In his own words "our contract doesn't have wording that we will allow you to switch uplines after 6 months of non production. The way I see it is if that upline helped you and trained you to sell final expense we should not release you ever."

My response was..... but they never wrote you for F.E. before I came onboard... Didnt know anything about your product and never tought me a thing about F.E. (anyway my mistake for trusting them to release)


Sorry for the rant but just wanted to give you guys a heads up.

Yes, they make mistakes but I haven't found them to make any more mistakes than any other company. But I have found them to be the best at correcting those mistakes. I put them right along the lines of RNA in problem solving.

And they are slow to issue. My biggest gripe about them though is not issuing a policy until after the first draft. We have had many discussions about that.

Other agents hate the $3000/mo advance cap. I'm as earned so it doesn't affect me but , if I were on advancing that would be a big issue.

As far as the release stuff, I don't have that problem with my IMO.

 

[rousemark]

I prefer to write policies. That "never happened" before sounds like what we we taught when UL first came out and we glossed over the guaranteed column.

I will write a Fraternal if there is a reason for a particular case. Last year a number of us wrote the NCSF GI to death. It spanked all the other GIs. So there was a reason to gamble on a fraternal. KSKJ's premium may be a reason if I am in a competitive position. Or if the client picks them. I many times show the FexQuotes sheets. I educate my clients and recommend what I do and they decide.

KSKJ is the company today. Last year it was X, next year it will be Y.

Make your own decision. No one else is going to cut you a check.

Oh and yeah, a year ago a recruiter would have been laughed off the forum at 100%. Us FU guys would love to get a consistent 100% on permanent products.

In the old days the "flavor of the month" concerning insurance companies changed often due to some agents (not all) going back and replacing the business they wrote the year before so they would get a new first year commission. I would guess not much has changed over the years.