Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2Go to Top
This is the second part and it primarily concerns lead volume. Lead volume is a big consideration when selecting a lead company. We all want as many good leads as we can get. However, remember that lead volume can be inversely related to lead quality. When a company claims they have a plethora of leads, that can be a warning sign in many ways. The first way is that it might simply be a lie to make you believe they can send you more leads than they really have. The second is that they may be reselling leads generated elsewhere or old leads that are aged or recycled. After all there are only so many people shopping for insurance in any given place at any given time.
Fortunately, there are simple tools you can use online, for free, that can help you investigate the traffic volumes of any website. Compete.com is one of them and it lets you do side by side comparisons.
Let's say lead company XYZ, an old and very established lead company, says they are growing (even in this terrible economy) and process 600,000 "applications" a month. Sounds good right? You want to buy from a lead company that is growing and can give you lots of good leads, right? Lead companies know the answer to that question is most likely "yes." Therefore, you must be suspicious when you hear it and do your own investigation. Fortunately, a compete.com unique visitor report can help shed some light onto the veracity of growth statements, at least when it comes to traffic. Here are the monthly unique visitors of three of the oldest companies in the internet insurance lead business compared on compete.com:
First of all, none of these companies have grown their volume of traffic over the last year. Let's face it, over these last 6 months or so, who has? So much for insurance being recession-proof! Last time I looked at the stock price of any big insurance company, it was DOWN. A claim like that just doesn't make sense for an older, more established, lead company that has a slower growth rate as a result. Especially if their lead volume is being generated through "interesting" and possibly unsustainable ways (see part 1.) A new lead company could make such a statement because growth is a term that is relative to prior figures, but I don't know if you want to be with a new lead company either.
So, if XYZ company told you that they were growing, you might want to question the veracity of that statement and likewise other claims and representations that they are making. "Growth" is a relative term and just like other representations, may be subject to definition. You may wish to ask just what that definition is! You also might want to ask the sources of their lead volume. After all, a Compete.com report only show the traffic on that particular website. Therefore, a company can still increase the volume of leads in absence of an increase in traffic. However, a claim like this, in the absence of an increase in web traffic, might indicate growing another way. That other way may be very important to know. BTW, my hat goes off to Insureme for having an up month last month, good job!
Look for part 3 next week.
------------------------------------
Michael Levy
Chairman and Founder
MostChoice.com, Inc.
Search Engine Only Generated Insurance Leads
Re: Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2Go to Top
Originally Posted by emptyeternity
You should do a thread on each lead provider and let people draw their own conclusions.
Are you sure you want the truth?
Think carefully before you decide on the blue or the red pill.
------------------------------------
Mark
"Corner Bar"---Independent Agent Anthem
My credit score's fallen like the New York Mets
There ain't a debt collector that ain't called yet
They say, "Money don't talk, it only swears"
And got me cussing in my underwear
Re: Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2Go to Top
Originally Posted by CHUMPS FROM OXFORD
So what does that tell us about Benepath?
In my opinion, that data would indicate that benepath.com is either buying leads from other lead generators and re-selling them or generating leads and selling them to other lead generators or a combination of the two. However, some of those websites could also be owned by benepath. This is where affinity scores and knowledge of the other websites is important.
This is only what I can glean from that information. Other information could indicate otherwise. I just don't have any other information. Until this post, I had never even heard of them.
Re: Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2Go to Top
We do not buy leads from any source - 100% of our leads are generated on our site.
When we get traffic from an area where we have no agents we sell that traffic to VIMO. This is not a secret.
The source of this info also does a really poor job in its data collection. Its estimate of our monthly traffic for instance is about 10% of our actual traffic level.
Further, we do not sell leads to VIMO - just the traffic - so we don't send leads to them and there is never an opportunity for one of our exclusive leads to go there.
Finally, people likely to visit one site are only likely to visit other sites because the sites are similar. The site itself does not say these people visited the other sites, just that based on overall data, they are likely to go to those sites.
Go read the actual report and you will see that it says these people are likely to visit - not that they actually visited.
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Also, Mike should know that knowing that someone visited one site and another site has 0 probability of indicating if any lead generating site is selling leads back and forth. The process of selling a lead has nothing to do with traffic.
It may indicate if someone is selling or buying traffic, meaning redirecting the person to a different site, but not buying or selling actual leads.
The only way to find out if someone is buying or selling leads is to get leads from that source and find out where they entered their information.
Then if that info does not match up, to make sure they are buying leads from a different source, you have to actually get a copy of the history of all the sites the person visited and the pages on those sites.
You can then see if the person visited multiple sites or just one site.
That will tell you if they are buying leads from other companies.
Last edited by Clelland.Green : 03-03-2009 at 10:15 AM.
Reason: Posts merged
Re: Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2Go to Top
Originally Posted by Clelland.Green
We do not buy leads from any source - 100% of our leads are generated on our site.
When we get traffic from an area where we have no agents we sell that traffic to VIMO. This is not a secret.
The source of this info also does a really poor job in its data collection. Its estimate of our monthly traffic for instance is about 10% of our actual traffic level.
Further, we do not sell leads to VIMO - just the traffic - so we don't send leads to them and there is never an opportunity for one of our exclusive leads to go there.
Finally, people likely to visit one site are only likely to visit other sites because the sites are similar. The site itself does not say these people visited the other sites, just that based on overall data, they are likely to go to those sites.
Go read the actual report and you will see that it says these people are likely to visit - not that they actually visited.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Also, Mike should know that knowing that someone visited one site and another site has 0 probability of indicating if any lead generating site is selling leads back and forth. The process of selling a lead has nothing to do with traffic.
It may indicate if someone is selling or buying traffic, meaning redirecting the person to a different site, but not buying or selling actual leads.
The only way to find out if someone is buying or selling leads is to get leads from that source and find out where they entered their information.
Then if that info does not match up, to make sure they are buying leads from a different source, you have to actually get a copy of the history of all the sites the person visited and the pages on those sites.
You can then see if the person visited multiple sites or just one site.
That will tell you if they are buying leads from other
Companies.
Neither one have Quality SEO Leads. They are PPC leads which are low converting high cost leads. They bid on Cheap keywords to generate thier so called SEO rich leads.
Re: Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2Go to Top
I really do not want the names but from everyone's experience with lead companies out there are there any good companies to buy internet leads from. I bought from a few companies but the biggest problem is that they are all doing the same thing . I found a few companies that did not do like all the rest but that does not last only a month or two then the leads go downhill. Is my experience the same as everyone else.
Re: Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2Go to Top
Hey Dave,
That is your opinion. Search is search and most consumers don't know the difference. Regardless, search "health insurance rates" and "health insurance quotes" - we are on page 1 for both. Benepath.com gets "organic" traffic from over 50 terms.
Re: Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2Go to Top
Originally Posted by Clelland.Green
Regardless, search "health insurance rates" and "health insurance quotes" - we are on page 1 for both.Benepath.com gets "organic" traffic from over 50 terms.
Re: Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2Go to Top
Originally Posted by Clelland.Green
Hey Dave,
That is your opinion. Search is search and most consumers don't know the difference. Regardless, search "health insurance rates" and "health insurance quotes" - we are on page 1 for both. Benepath.com gets "organic" traffic from over 50 terms.
I do agree that most consumers don't know the difference between a generic search result, and a PPC ad.
They are making the PPC ads look more closely like generic a search result.
------------------------------------ Michigan Health Insurance Is my main site. Check out the links directory, more than 9875 helpful links and growing.
Re: Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2Go to Top
Originally Posted by Clelland.Green
Hey Dave,
That is your opinion. Search is search and most consumers don't know the difference. Regardless, search "health insurance rates" and "health insurance quotes" - we are on page 1 for both. Benepath.com gets "organic" traffic from over 50 terms.
Oh really, Tells me you dont know much about Conversion. Depends on the Market, tangible items, PPC is the King. Health Insurance? Not even close for quality of consumers, Your tire kickers will play the quote game, but serious true organic searched terms with websites that have quality content will win every time. Just landing on a page that may say there state name and some boiler plate comment is not a quality lead.
P.S. I would not be boasting that a National Health Site that targets the United States ranks for only 50 terms. A real site will rank for 50 relevant terms just for one state.
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Originally Posted by Clelland.Green
Hey Dave,
That is your opinion. Search is search and most consumers don't know the difference. Regardless, search "health insurance rates" and "health insurance quotes" - we are on page 1 for both. Benepath.com gets "organic" traffic from over 50 terms.
I would take a look at your ranking and traffic, considering that is a huge Broad Term, Being on Page 2 does not drive that much traffic. Also you might want to fix your Meta Description, a bit on the spammy side. Studies have also proven that having elipses (...) reduce your click thru rate by 25%
Compare health insurance quotes and find affordable health insurance rates. Benepath will get quotes and rates on affordable health insurance plans based on ...
Be glad to optimize your site for a small Fee
Last edited by dmiller90 : 03-03-2009 at 02:27 PM.
Reason: Posts merged
Re: Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2Go to Top
Originally Posted by dmiller90
Oh really, Tells me you dont know much about Conversion. Depends on the Market, tangible items, PPC is the King. Health Insurance? Not even close for quality of consumers, Your tire kickers will play the quote game, but serious true organic searched terms with websites that have quality content will win every time. Just landing on a page that may say there state name and some boiler plate comment is not a quality lead.
P.S. I would not be boasting that a National Health Site that targets the United States ranks for only 50 terms. A real site will rank for 50 relevant terms just for one state.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I would take a look at your ranking and traffic, considering that is a huge Broad Term, Being on Page 2 does not drive that much traffic. Also you might want to fix your Meta Description, a bit on the spammy side. Studies have also proven that having elipses (...) reduce your click thru rate by 25%
Compare health insurance quotes and find affordable health insurance rates. Benepath will get quotes and rates on affordable health insurance plans based on ...
Be glad to optimize your site for a small Fee
Hi Dave,
First, we actually we got organic traffc on 394 keywords over the last 3 months (after your comment I had to get an exact number). There are about 50 that make up most of the traffic.
You do bring up some excellent points and I appreciate your feedback on the ellipses. I looked into that comment and could not find any research that supports that position.
In fact, I found numerous articles that said using ellipses actually is a strategy to Improve click thru rates. One researcher said his response went up 135% when he added the ellipses to his google CPC campaigns.
My point on organic vs cpc is that most consumers do not know the difference. Research shows that anywhere from 40% to 75% of internet users do not know the difference between a paid and an organic listing on the search engines.
Yes, organic visitors do convert into leads better (2-5% in our case). But I have searched for the last hour and have found no research that shows that people who convert into leads from organic convert into sales better for agents. I would love to see research that supports your conclusion.
As to cheap keywords - I really don't know of any. We are bidding on all the top keywords and it costs a lot of money per click. We are not an affiliate trying to make money at $10 per lead (about how much lead companies pay affiliates before returns) - so we are bidding competitively and its very expensive.
As to the best keyword being health insurance itself, well, I guess that is good news for ehealthinsurance as they own the #1 and #3 spots (healthinsurance.org is an affiliate to ehealth) and Aetna has the #2 spot now. Considering that those spots get 78% of the search traffic (Cornell Univ) that is bad news for all of us...
In fact, most of the rest of the traffic goes to the paid listings on that term. So, the players below that organically don't get much traffic - although at 4M searches a month, 1% would be a lot.
Regardless, we are very committed and are making a serious investment to constantly update content, adding articles to our blogs, and optimizing to generate more and more organic traffic.
Thanks for your feedback!
Clelland
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Originally Posted by moonlightandmargaritas
Just Googled "health insurance quotes".
Didn't find Benepath until page two...
That happens on Google. Right now we are on page one and have been on page one more often than not over the last few weeks.
Google sometimes throws a site out of nowhere to the middle of page 1, knocking off the #10 or #9 listing. Last week, we had the terms "health insurance plan" and "compare health insurance" in the middle of page 1 - we knew it was not permanent when it happened. But that impacted someone else.
You can also find us on page 1 for other terms like
Health insurance prices
Affordable health insurance quotes
Affordable health insurance rates
Compare health insurance qutoes
Last edited by Clelland.Green : 03-04-2009 at 10:08 AM.
Reason: Posts merged
Re: Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2Go to Top
Originally Posted by Clelland.Green
Hi Dave,
First, we actually we got organic traffc on 394 keywords over the last 3 months (after your comment I had to get an exact number). There are about 50 that make up most of the traffic.
You do bring up some excellent points and I appreciate your feedback on the ellipses. I looked into that comment and could not find any research that supports that position.
In fact, I found numerous articles that said using ellipses actually is a strategy to Improve click thru rates. One researcher said his response went up 135% when he added the ellipses to his google CPC campaigns.
My point on organic vs cpc is that most consumers do not know the difference. Research shows that anywhere from 40% to 75% of internet users do not know the difference between a paid and an organic listing on the search engines.
Yes, organic visitors do convert into leads better (2-5% in our case). But I have searched for the last hour and have found no research that shows that people who convert into leads from organic convert into sales better for agents. I would love to see research that supports your conclusion.
As to cheap keywords - I really don't know of any. We are bidding on all the top keywords and it costs a lot of money per click. We are not an affiliate trying to make money at $10 per lead (about how much lead companies pay affiliates before returns) - so we are bidding competitively and its very expensive.
As to the best keyword being health insurance itself, well, I guess that is good news for ehealthinsurance as they own the #1 and #3 spots (healthinsurance.org is an affiliate to ehealth) and Aetna has the #2 spot now. Considering that those spots get 78% of the search traffic (Cornell Univ) that is bad news for all of us...
In fact, most of the rest of the traffic goes to the paid listings on that term. So, the players below that organically don't get much traffic - although at 4M searches a month, 1% would be a lot.
Regardless, we are very committed and are making a serious investment to constantly update content, adding articles to our blogs, and optimizing to generate more and more organic traffic.
Thanks for your feedback!
Clelland
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
That happens on Google. Right now we are on page one and have been on page one more often than not over the last few weeks.
Google sometimes throws a site out of nowhere to the middle of page 1, knocking off the #10 or #9 listing. Last week, we had the terms "health insurance plan" and "compare health insurance" in the middle of page 1 - we knew it was not permanent when it happened. But that impacted someone else.
You can also find us on page 1 for other terms like
Health insurance prices
Affordable health insurance quotes
Affordable health insurance rates
Compare health insurance qutoes
What influences the user is the heading, the description, and the position on the page. To make a blanket statement like SEO is better or PPC is better misses the point entirely. As for a generic term like "Health Insurance" think about how many different ways a person could be looking for that term. It could be to get a quote. They could be in a claims dispute and be looking for information on how to settle a claim. They could be interested in Obama's new plan. There are an infinite number of possible interests on a term that generic. It's best that eHealthinsurance just pays for that traffic.
In the end, you are going to see SEO organic get pushed to the second page of all results listings. It's not hard to tell that this is coming. The first page has been shrinking for organic listings as Search Engines look to increase revenues by adding more paid listings. You can't expect Google to give away commercial terms for free forever. Also, Google is "typing" websites now. I assume everyone read the article in the New York Times from a few months ago. If not, I'll dig it up.
While Organic traffic is great for the lead generator, it's very profitable, it's a moving target and doesn't provide consistent volume as Google changes it's algorithim constantly with major changes occuring twice a year or so. They also clear there SERPS regularly and re-index causing everyone to do what is known as "The Google Dance."
When it comes to providing volume, the lead generators that can manage long-tail PPC advertising effectively will be left standing 18 to 24 months from now. Best of luck to the rest...
Re: Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2Go to Top
Couple things, I'm not taken by Mike's carefully crafted PR pieces.
Is there a correlation between specific sites and lead quality? I understand the bit about incentives, but if that lead also cruised 5 of your competitors, I would imagine the lead quality is lower because of higher competition and increased buying pressure on the prospect.
Mike also still needs to resolve the issues with Greensky on the other thread. His good PR is out-weighed at this point. But I guess you can post tip #3 since you already wrote it anyway.
Maybe Mike's competition is growing because he never heard of them and they're doing PR campaigns to consumers to increase traffic (instead of PR to agents). In fact they are; I think I heard something about articles and stuff. It's hard to benchmark competition if you don't know they exist.
On that note, "long tail" keywords can sometimes be more effective than main keywords because it's easier to customize landing pages to buyer behavior and there tends to be less competition from no-soul companies (think about keyword lifecycles here). I would worry less about my rank on the big keywords than my performance and conversion on the smaller ones. In that vein, the price of a click does not convey its quality.
For most companies, 1% of the market is a huge number. I'm glad to hear from the companies that are growing.
Free Online Tools To Help Evaluate Lead Companies, Part 2
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