Med Sup

[vic120]

Re fun, yes and no. It's chazm's fault-when he made the crack about the average price of a used car, I couldn't resist. Maybe most of the "conversion" threads have gone the other way, someone being sold an MAPD to replace a supplement, but I'm pretty sure there was at least one thread recently where someone's client was sold an HDF based on price, didn't understand what they were getting and the agent was trying to get them out of it. It just seemed like another relevant example of variations chazm was suggesting the op was totally missing when asking for "averages" to base some business decisions on.

As far as "no" is concerned, an HDF plan IS a plan F. It has the characteristics of F which I mentioned above.

For this to make sense, I need to digress slightly. I am a charter member of the Whiners Club of the Greater Midwest. If, in that capacity, I was to start a thread about my life insurance and say that I started out paying $215 a year for my policy, but it is now only $190 a year, so I wasted that $25 a year for however many years by just giving it to the insurance company, one of the first posters to show up would be volagent. Volagent would be asking me questions centered on why I expect to get something for nothing. Like that 80 mph headon collision you missed by the width of a fender, would you rather have died in that so "you" could have collected on your ADD rider? Or, it's not the insurance company's fault you didn't exercise your guaranteed additional insurance rider. Volagent is trying to teach me to forget about what I "like" and learn to look at the coverage and the dollars being paid and see what you are buying.

Now let's bring that back to Medicare supplements. HDF and F are both a plan F. HDF includes all the characteristics of an F. When I buy medical insurance I buy two things. I buy a negotiator and I buy the right to have the insurance company pay for some medical bills. In this case I buy the services of the federal government as a negotiator. I agree to pay for things they don't cover. When I can find a dr that accepts medicare, he/she agrees to accept what the government pays. The government sets the rules for the supplement plans. Plan F has a rule set that applies whether it is HDF or F. What we have is an additional rule for HDF that gives me the opportunity to pay only for catastrophic coverage from the insurance company. That does not mean that first dollar coverage and excess charge coverage are not there. They are. My out of pocket costs with HDF are less than they would be with plan L precisely because of that. And I get credit for them against my outofpocket requirement. That is the equivalent of getting them paid out in cash in a higher premium plan.

If I had a dollar for as many people I speak to that are crying they can't get a better plan than High Deductible F because they no longer qualify health wise

I am trying to follow what you are talking about high F is F because of it follows the rule of F,even though there is a deductible ? is than plan G a plan F because it pays excess charges and follows the same rule ?

 

[Chazm]

If I had a dollar for as many people I speak to that are crying they can't get a better plan than High Deductible F because they no longer qualify health wise

I am trying to follow what you are talking about high F is F because of it follows the rule of F,even though there is a deductible ? is than plan G a plan F because it pays excess charges and follows the same rule ?

I hope to Buddha he never gets a license. His overthinking of everything will have his clients head spinning.

His thought process of a HDF being the same as an F is ludicrous. And your analogy of plan G hits the nail on the head.

I need to stop feeding into his post that he knows zero about. All of them.

 

[LostDollar]

If I had a dollar for as many people I speak to that are crying they can't get a better plan than High Deductible F because they no longer qualify health wise

I would discuss that more in my thread in the consumer section from when I was choosing a plan. I am not going to do it here.

I am trying to follow what you are talking about high F is F because of it follows the rule of even though there is a deductible ? is than plan G a plan F because it pays excess charges and follows the same rule ?

No. You sell this stuff everyday and have details memorized better than I do. In that column chart there is a column for plan F and another for plan G and another for plan L and another for plan N.

That is because, although they are all Medicare supplements, they have different specific features in regard to both the services covered and Part A and B deductibles, coinsurance and copay obligations of the policy holder. HDF is footnoted from the plan F column. It has the same insurance features as plan F. You can see this if you compare the HDF option of plan F with plan L.

What I have readily available as I am writing is 2016 info in my Ks shoppers guide. For plan HDF I have to pay an out of pocket $2180 deductible. For a plan L I have to pay an out of pocket of $2480 plus the Part B deductible plus any excess charges from care providers.

The government has created a way for me to self insure part of my medical bill risk by putting a catastrophic coverage umbrella option in the full featured plan F. The features do not change, they are just accounted for differently. If I pay a high premium and get my part B deductible paid for or if I pay a low premium and get my part B deductible subtracted from my out of pocket obligation, I have gotten the effect of plan F coverage of the part B deductible.
The same principle applies to excess charges-and in a catastrophic expense year, the HDF plan will pick up paying those just like the base plan F would as soon as I meet my out of pocket (high deductible) requirement.

 

[Todd King]

I would discuss that more in my thread in the consumer section from when I was choosing a plan. I am not going to do it here.




No. You sell this stuff everyday and have details memorized better than I do. In that column chart there is a column for plan F and another for plan G and another for plan L and another for plan N.

That is because, although they are all Medicare supplements, they have different specific features in regard to both the services covered and Part A and B deductibles, coinsurance and copay obligations of the policy holder. HDF is footnoted from the plan F column. It has the same insurance features as plan F. You can see this if you compare the HDF option of plan F with plan L.

What I have readily available as I am writing is 2016 info in my Ks shoppers guide. For plan HDF I have to pay an out of pocket $2180 deductible. For a plan L I have to pay an out of pocket of $2480 plus the Part B deductible plus any excess charges from care providers.

The government has created a way for me to self insure part of my medical bill risk by putting a catastrophic coverage umbrella option in the full featured plan F. The features do not change, they are just accounted for differently. If I pay a high premium and get my part B deductible paid for or if I pay a low premium and get my part B deductible subtracted from my out of pocket obligation, I have gotten the effect of plan F coverage of the part B deductible.
The same principle applies to excess charges-and in a catastrophic expense year, the HDF plan will pick up paying those just like the base plan F would as soon as I meet my out of pocket (high deductible) requirement.

That's called a Plan G right there! What they are trying to tell you is that Plan G is closer to being a Plan F than the HDF. See?

So no, a HDF is NOT a Plan F no more than Plan G is a Plan F.

 

[sman]

I would discuss that more in my thread in the consumer section from when I was choosing a plan. I am not going to do it here.




No. You sell this stuff everyday and have details memorized better than I do. In that column chart there is a column for plan F and another for plan G and another for plan L and another for plan N.

That is because, although they are all Medicare supplements, they have different specific features in regard to both the services covered and Part A and B deductibles, coinsurance and copay obligations of the policy holder. HDF is footnoted from the plan F column. It has the same insurance features as plan F. You can see this if you compare the HDF option of plan F with plan L.

What I have readily available as I am writing is 2016 info in my Ks shoppers guide. For plan HDF I have to pay an out of pocket $2180 deductible. For a plan L I have to pay an out of pocket of $2480 plus the Part B deductible plus any excess charges from care providers.

The government has created a way for me to self insure part of my medical bill risk by putting a catastrophic coverage umbrella option in the full featured plan F. The features do not change, they are just accounted for differently. If I pay a high premium and get my part B deductible paid for or if I pay a low premium and get my part B deductible subtracted from my out of pocket obligation, I have gotten the effect of plan F coverage of the part B deductible.
The same principle applies to excess charges-and in a catastrophic expense year, the HDF plan will pick up paying those just like the base plan F would as soon as I meet my out of pocket (high deductible) requirement.

I don't mean any disrespect, but you really need to stop saying that HDF and Plan F are the same. There's a reason carriers put an asterisk next to the second F on the chart. That's because there is something different with HDF as compared to Plan F. Just like there is something different with a Select Plan F than a regular Plan F. For those of us who actually interact with clients on a regular basis, if we were to make statement you've made we could be subject to a lawsuit and our E&O probably wouldn't protect us.

And if you are going to start working as a person who advises other Medicare beneficiaries (whether as an agent or a volunteer), you really need to gain more knowledge. Giving poor advice can harm people financially.

 

[LostDollar]

Page 82 of Medicare and You very carefully and clearly states that the high deductible plan is a plan F option. G is irrelevant there, it is in a different column with different characteristics. Plan F and its HDF option both offer the same complete coverage of all the benefit options except foreign travel which is listed at 80%.

 

[goillini52]

Page 82 of Medicare and You very carefully and clearly states that the high deductible plan is a plan F option. G is irrelevant there, it is in a different column with different characteristics. Plan F and its HDF option both offer the same complete coverage of all the benefit options except foreign travel which is listed at 80%.

You really learn fast LD. In just a couple of months you already know more than any of the agents that sell Med Supps. Some have been doing it for 30-40 years....and you don't even have a license. What a waste.

 

[vic120]

Page 82 of Medicare and You very carefully and clearly states that the high deductible plan is a plan F option. G is irrelevant there, it is in a different column with different characteristics. Plan F and its HDF option both offer the same complete coverage of all the benefit options except foreign travel which is listed at 80%.

What are the different characteristics of plan G vrs F & HDF?

 

[FLM2]

Hahahaa, when are you getting your license?

Since I have LostDollar on ignore I don't normally read what he posts but after reading his comments that have been quoted on this thread it just amazes me how someone who spends so much time pontificating and researching about Medicare could state so many factual inaccuracies, it's just a complete lack of understanding.

 

[goillini52]

Since I have LostDollar on ignore I don't normally read what he posts but after reading his comments that have been quoted on this thread it just amazes me how someone who spends so much time pontificating and researching about Medicare could state so many factual inaccuracies, it's just a complete lack of understanding.

LD's a character...he means well.