How Much Do You Leave?

Mr. Bill · 09-11-2009, 11:18 AM

Wow. More wacky complaining. Personally, I think we ought to go Euro and eliminate this whole crazy tipping thing altogether!

A Waiter Argues Against the 15 Percent Tip

Epicurious.com, on Wed Sep 9, 2009 8:42am PDT

Slashfood's Hanna Raskin has made an interesting (and controversial) argument that restaurant customers are doing themselves and their servers a disservice by leaving a "standard" 15-percent tip for good service.

"Want to really confuse your server? Leave a 15-percent tip," she writes. "There's nothing more ambiguous than the 15-percent tip, which could just as well be a 'thanks for nothing' grat from a miffed diner who always leaves 20 percent or a sincere show of gratitude from an infrequent restaurantgoer who thinks 15 percent is still the going rate for good service. Only the tipper knows for sure."

According to Raskin (blogger, server and food-tour organizer) leaving a 15-percent tip isn't just rude, it's also unrealistic, insensitive, ungrateful and outdated.

Think that $3 tip on a $20 bill is fine? Think again, she says. If you want to let your server know he or she did a fine job, you're going to have to do better.

"Surveys show the vast majority of Americans have transitioned away from the 15-percent standard which ruled the food and beverage industry for decades, with the national average tip rising to 19 percent in 2008," she writes. "Just as the public realized that folks who toil on assembly lines and sell costume jewelry at the mall deserve a minimum wage, diners have finally caught on to the real value of service. As we approach Labor Day, your server thanks you for that."

What do you tip? What do you think of Raskin's argument? Anyone care to add additional points for her case? Anyone care make the argument for a 15-percent tip for decent service?

by Michael Y. Park

Rivers1 · 09-11-2009, 11:57 AM

I think she just gave herself a pay cut from future customers.

Personally, if I dine alone I leave 20%, but if I'm with a party, 15-20%.

xrac · 09-12-2009, 10:12 PM

I think she should take 15% be thankful and shut up or else find another line of work.

al3 · 09-13-2009, 01:40 AM

I tip 10% if the service is poor, 15% if just average, and 20% for above-average (excellent) service. I take a client or prospect out to either lunch or dinner three or four days a week and my guess is I tip the 20% more than 90% of the time. I will often tip 25% if I have a drink or wine because the bartender should get something, but most of the time I don't have a drink because I refuse to pay inflated prices for booze. Five bucks for a bottle of beer? Yeah, right!

GreenSky · 09-13-2009, 08:10 AM

The best thing to do is to ask the waiter if he/she is an Obama supporter. If so, give the tip to the homeless guy outside because you too believe in sharing the wealth.

Rick

xrac · 09-13-2009, 08:35 AM

Originally Posted by GreenSky

The best thing to do is to ask the waiter if he/she is an Obama supporter. If so, give the tip to the homeless guy outside because you too believe in sharing the wealth.

Rick

Rick, I am beginning to get nervous since I agree with you again!

stormtracker · 09-13-2009, 09:02 AM

I tip strictly based on the service-- not the quality of food. It is not the WW's (TGIFriday's ex's know this abbreviation) fault if the kitchen screws up. I recently had a coupon to Cracker Barrel (yes Al, a place where white folks congregate) for $5 off a $20 dollar ticket. We showed our WW the coupon so she kept us informed of our bill as we went so we would hit the magic $20 threshold. When we did, we tabbed out and proceeded to check out. There we were informed that the bill had to be $20 WITHOUT tax. Hmm. That meant that we didn't get our $5 off. I didn't leave a tip because the WW should have been aware of this "fine print" stipulation.

GreenSky · 09-13-2009, 09:23 AM

Originally Posted by xrac

Rick, I am beginning to get nervous since I agree with you again!

Just a sign of maturity and intelligence.

Rick
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Originally Posted by al3

I tip 10% if the service is poor

Why would you tip at all if the service is poor? You would be doing a service to society if you don't leave a tip and speak with the manager.

You are promoting socialism by failing to have people earn their living. If a waiter can earn 10% without really working and that waiter is happy with this, where is the incentive to work?

Would you have the guts to complain if you were "cloaked?"

Rick

Winter · 09-13-2009, 10:01 AM

Originally Posted by GreenSky

You are promoting socialism by failing to have people earn their living.

Rick

It's part of the "Above-Average" epidemic in America. The average grade in high school and college now is an A or a B. Last week, for example, I got a couple life insurance policies issued on people that were rated "standard plus" or standard better" whatever. They had a couple dings on their health but nothing serious so those were very good ratings. However, in this society where everyone gets an A or a B in college for breathing you end out dealing with their culture shock that they could possibly be anything less than preferred. It all fits together.

My freshman year of college I had a few very large lecture hall type classes as most freshman have. At the end of the semester everyone and I mean everyone was rated on a bell curve. Not surprisingly some people are average and some aren't. Also, many, many people just plain flunked out, duh. Nowadays you start out with the expectation that everyone is going to get an A or B and it is the professors job to tip you extra if you underperform because he/she does not want to get a poor evaluation from the students when they do the surveys. Some of my profs were good but they were not concerned about earning our love.

Also check the fine print on your restaurant bill. Half the time the 15% is built in already and then you put 20% on top to help them and you to feel good. Tis the American way. A little bit of entitlement and a little bit of reward. Sometimes more of one than the other.

Mr. Bill · 09-13-2009, 10:43 AM

The last time I left 2 cents (yes, 2 cents and 2 cents only) was at a very famous old establishment where they have a buffet service at lunch. We waited far too long to be paid attention to by a waitress who couldn't care less. So separately, I had to leave a tip for the carver at the carving station, and the busboy (who was probably in his 50s) ended up being the one who took care of us. So, as I said, the carver got a tip, the lameass waitress got her 2 pennies, I told the busboy when I gave him $5 directly not to share it with the waitress as she didn't deserve it. I only left the pennies so she would know I didn't forget about her.

I guess it's times like that I'm glad we have a tip system.

Really, though, I wish Obama would use his Superhero Hope & Change Powers to eliminate it!

al3 · 09-13-2009, 11:16 AM

Originally Posted by GreenSky

Why would you tip at all if the service is poor?

The places I most often go for lunch or dinner have linen table cloths and silverware. That's probably a concept foreign to most of those here who are more used to plastic red-checker-board table covers and plastic (or no) utensils.

These places have a bus-person as most often a bartender. I want them to get something for their efforts but I want them to also "question" the wait-person as to why the tip was so low.

You would be doing a service to society if you don't leave a tip and speak with the manager.

It is not my job to make a restaurant better. It is their job to know what to do and make my meal enjoyable. Only a neo-con or a libertarian goes into a restaurant with the objective of re-making it in his or her own image.

You are promoting socialism by failing to have people earn their living. If a waiter can earn 10% without really working and that waiter is happy with this, where is the incentive to work?

His incentive to work or not work is not my issue. I only care about the outcome. The management can deal with the rest. I pick my battles and at the end of the day if the meal is good or bad... or the service is good or bad... it does not change my life one bit.

The 10% sends a message. Unless the waiter was obnoxious to you (which I doubt happens often... never has to me) or you simply never GOT your meal, than you I think you are justified to leave nothing. But otherwise the service was rendered (perhaps not to your liking) and something should be paid for it. I don't live in a world of greed and avarice like most of you guys do. Sorry. Liberals are like that. We cut people a bit of slack.

My guess is that you never tip at all, because I can't see any wait-person measuring up to your high standards... or that of any Libertarian or neo-con.

Would you have the guts to complain if you were "cloaked?"

I only complain if the food is bad, and the places I go to never have bad food... at least when I'm there.

And by the way, if you take clients out to lunch often check out your local newspaper (especially the weekly "alternative" ones that concentrate on entertainment and arts) for 2-for-1 coupons.

I used to think that clients would consider you "cheap" if you used them (or the Entertainment Card if you have those... every Oct. I have" get one from a client I write... no way to escape it. Their kid's school sells them.) However clients don't care if you use a 2-for-1 coupon. Several have said "That's a smart idea."

Frugal is "in" these days.

I usually only eat half the lunch and take the rest home for dinner or lunch tomorrow if I'm going to be home. If I ate the whole meal as often as I go out, I'd be larger than the Met blimp!

Al
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