-GI IS A COMPLETE FAILURE!!! Costs are very high a couple in NJ on a $1000 deductible is almost $4000 per month with BCBS NJ
-State risk pool IS the solution but this is not politically correct.
-Obama would REQUIRE GI in all states!!! Making ALL individual plans unaffordable. why? Simple he wants government run health care and this is one way to get to that goal faster.
-McCains plan is scary as well - to allow the purchase of individual insurance across state lines - HUGE FAILURE, but not on the scale of Obamas plan.
Just another case of uneducated public, uneducated politicians.
GI is the biggest failure in the industry and is laughable. People need to be careful what they ask for "CHANGE" is not always better.
Now that being said the industry needs to clean up their act big time - standardize plans A through Z, fix the maternity crisis, come to agreement on waivers vs. rate ups, come to agreement on COCC as it applies to previous individual coverage and pre ex.
The industry has also pushed the envelope too far lets be fair.
Many agents are fooled into think the carrier is on their side. Carriers want Universal Healthcare (not government health care, but universal) this equals a much larger based an more money.
The best thing a carrier can hope for is everyone has to be covered, it is private, it is sold direct and without agents getting a cut.
How come it works fine in every other modern Western nation?
That is not true at all, it does not work well in most modern Western nations. In any case, none of them have the cost of care that we have.
It is an inescapable fact that actual care costs far more in the states than it does anywhere else. Partly because of high doctors salaries, partly because of the lack of tort reform and partly because of capitalism. Until you figure out how to drive down those costs, there are no solutions without a HUGE tax increase and when push comes to shove, people will not be able to swallow that.
That is not true at all, it does not work well in most modern Western nations. In any case, none of them have the cost of care that we have.
It is an inescapable fact that actual care costs far more in the states than it does anywhere else. Partly because of high doctors salaries, partly because of the lack of tort reform and partly because of capitalism. Until you figure out how to drive down those costs, there are no solutions without a HUGE tax increase and when push comes to shove, people will not be able to swallow that.
Sam, Sam, Sam. When are you going to realize that capitalism is the root of all evil?
As far as huge tax increase, that's nonsense. We have an unlimited supply of money and if my health insurance was free, I wouldn't mind paying 30-40-50% more on my taxes.
The average primary physician nets about $125,000 per year. No one needs to earn more than $90,000 even if there is about $300,000 in student loans to pay. Let them work for the government in the health care clinics. That's where I want my son to go for his care. And don't get me started with all the money that is wasted in hospitals. MRI, CAT Scans, Transplants - all unnecessary expenses.
We need to allow US citizens go to Canada (or Cuba) for quality healthcare. Why should we have a monopoly on good medicine?
Damn it Sam. You are one selfish individual.
Rick
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Training, Community, Support, and Success Independent Life Insurance Agents Assn rick@iliaa.org
The US has an indemnity based health care system. The patient is treated, then billed at the going rate (whatever that is).
Everywhere else the providers are paid a salary regardless of how much, or little work is performed. Costs are controlled on the front end via wages and rationed services.
While our costs are higher, they are around 16% or so of GNP compared to 11% in other developed countries.
So the question is, what do we get and they give up for a 5% savings?
How come it works fine in every other modern Western nation?
We're going to have universal coverage in the USA in your lifetime. Anyone who believes otherwise is in total denial.
It's going to happen. Get over it.
It does not work in other nations the care is horrible. Good care costs money, and lots of it.
Profit yields investment, research and good care.
That being said the system is full of problems, big ones - but a complete tear down and rebuild is not the solution. Free markets are the solution, but that would require you believing in capitalism and America.
I would love to see our non portable Group Insurance model ripped to shreds, but an individual model requires personal responsibility, segregating the sick, and standardization reform - none of which will ever happen.
A complete government hostile take over will never happen. A hybrid "compromise" system will be slowly implemented over time.
We are many years off even if Obama gets in, I would argue we might even be closer if McCain gets in - as much as I dislike Obama I think the Health Industry might be safer, where McCain might actually get something through that will be damaging.
We heard all of the same crap in 1963 with Medicare.
We heard the same crap about voting rights in 1964.
We heard the same crap about getting to the moon.
We heard the same crap about people who carped about the New Deal.
You people have your collective heads up your collective a$$. No one cares about taxes or anything else. We have free public education (dismal as it is) and we will get universal care... just like every other industrialized nation has had for the past fifty to one hundred years. No one believes it will be terrific, but no one will lose their house or their life savings or have to spend down because they are sick.
I can see all of you posting here in 1962. "We'll never have socialized medicine... can't happen, will go broke, we can't afford it."
It's going to happen and you and all the right-wing whackos and all the left-wing pinkos, and all the idiot libertarians, and all the angels in heaven saying it won't .... won't make a difference.
Wake up and smell the coffee. People (even some people here) want wholesale change of the health care finance system... and it will happen. Only you folks who are too young or too stupid to know history believe it won't.
Is there anyone here with more than a 10th grade education? I don't think so... not when I read the idiotic logic as posted in this thread.
Capitalism, taxes, budgets, individual rights... it's all BS. There is nothing more powerful than an idea whose time has come... and the time for total overhaul of the health care system is here. Deny it all you want, bitch about it all you want, write tomes about how it won't work... but it's all been done before... and whether you believe it or not... healthcare reform is going to happen.
Those of you with half a brain will start the learning curve to some other line. The rest of you will simply vanish and I'm sure we will see you as a greeter at your local WalMart or asking people "You want fries with that" at your local Burger King.
Jeez, Louise is there anyone here who has ever read a history book on the labor movement of the 30s or the civil rights movement of the 50s or the anti-poverty movement of the 60s? Ignorant children. I'm surrounded by ignorant children!
We have free public education (dismal as it is) and we will get universal care...
Well put, I don't even need to comment on our horrible and wrongly funded education system. My property tax rates are around 4% to fund schools which illegals can attend. Is that fair?
We heard all of the same crap in 1963 with Medicare.
And look how that is going...
Is there anyone here with more than a 10th grade education
Really? So no tax dollars go to fund government education? According to the U.S. Census Bureau the government spent an average of $9,138 per student in 2006. Public school systems (government schools) received $521.1 billion in funding from federal, state and local sources.
You mean that my son goes to Piney Orchard Elementary which is in the 98% percentile of schools in our county with a 98 and 97 respective math and English scores and Baltimore city kids go to a run-down inner city school that's in the 68% percentile?
That's the answer? Using your "free education" example - poor people should get **** treatment and upper class should get better treatment?
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Its only free if YOU do not have to reach in your wallet and give it back or write a check.
You can't miss what you never had. Like deducting group insurance premiums from your check vs. mailing a check for individual coverage.
I hope you aren't serious about that. I consider the checks I write every quarter and send to the IRS "reaching in my wallet". As should anyone who is in the top 50% of wage earners in this country since they pay 97% of the federal income tax bill.
We heard all of the same crap in 1963 with Medicare.
We heard the same crap about voting rights in 1964.
We heard the same crap about getting to the moon.
We heard the same crap about people who carped about the New Deal.
You people have your collective heads up your collective a$$. No one cares about taxes or anything else. We have free public education (dismal as it is) and we will get universal care... just like every other industrialized nation has had for the past fifty to one hundred years. No one believes it will be terrific, but no one will lose their house or their life savings or have to spend down because they are sick.
This is just silly. The only thing those have in common is that they were doubted but ended up happening. What about all the silly commie ideas that did not end up working out? By and large the commie pinko's track record of large ideas that were doubted but whose time "had come" is a losing record.
If wanting something bad enough and thinking it's time had come were enough to change things, then communism would have worked better.
I live in a Canadian border city. I have received two calls in the last 60 days of Canadian residents wanting to buy IFP. While I am no expert on this topic, they must be calling for a reason.
Also, the top tax bracket in Canada is somewhere in the 47%-50% range. Can you imagine working for 50 cents on the dollar?
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