AARP Increases Membership Dues

[GreenSky]

Al, you never fail to take the bait.

Rick

 

[Newby]

First of all, it is not "old" people. It is "older" people. If you market to this demographic and don't know that, then I think you should call me (or someone) for marketing help. My take is that you are a young guy out there selling to older people but don't have the first clue about who they are, what concerns them, or how to converse with them. Given what you wrote above, you surely wouldn't be my agent. You sound way to argumentative and far too adamant in your beliefs to give me the comfort level that what you present to me is a balanced choice, as opposed to what is just best for you alone. You sound like a typical self-absorbed salesman.

That's the point I want to make. Guys like you and Rick, with your bad attitude toward anyone who dares take exception to you, is what give this industry a bad name. Guys like you and Rick and a couple of dozen others here are so convinced they are right about anything and everything that the image of the fast-talking, pushy, hard-sell insurance guy becomes paramount in my mind when I read your (collective) postings.

Sure, things didn't work at MOO, but there is no shame in trying. One day you will understand that the journey is the reward and that in life you will reach a number of dead-ends where you have to turn around and drive in a different direction. If you see that as a failure, you will miss out on a lot of the adventure that life holds. My bet is that you already have, as has Rick

You and Rick live in a zero-sum world... where if someone else is right, you are wrong.

I've failed at many, many, many business ventures. I've written software that never sold. I've written books that never sold. I've joined companies that failed. I've started businesses that never made a dime. My time with MOO was nothing compared to the above.

Guys like you and Rick who see shame in failure are guys who will lead a long boring life. You are never going to ask he pretty girl to dance because you are afraid she will say no. Guys like you and Rick who see people like me... who have tried many things but who have succeeded at very few, you are the guys that revel in mediocrity and are the guys who will never hit a home run because they are so afraid of striking out.

So if all the things I've failed at or all the things I've done (like MOO) that didn't work out helps boost your personal self-esteem, I'm fine with it. I don't live my life according to your level of mediocrity and I surely don't expect you to be out there on the edge where I've been.

In theory we should all be able to "get along." But guys like you and Rick and a sizable number of others in this venue really can't do that. And while this is the internet and not real life, I wonder how guys like you and Rick and the other cyber-reprobates are (and act) when out of the ether. (Well, I know how Rick acts because we once spoke on the phone... and one thing you can say about Rick is that he is consistent.)

Newby, you go ahead and castigate me and others for our foibles and misbegotten adventures. It's fine. You remind me of that old Irish epigram "I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they get up in the morning, that's as good as they're going to feel all day."

Thanks Al! I guess you've convinced me to close my doors, wait until I'm an "older person" because I certainly can't communicate with "older persons" until I'm much older then them.

Opps! I made an appointment with a woman for next week! Should I become a woman so I can identify with her also Al?

Al, my clients appreciate that I deal with FACTS, not opinions. I don't tell anyone that AARP is bad or that they should cancel their membership to AARP. I point out that they are not usually the best place to buy life insurance and that they are not always the best price on a Medicare Supplement plan. Then I show them the facts.

Al they like to know these things. In most cases they didn't know HOW to shop for a Med Sup. They just went the easiest route and had a LOT of ads from AARP hitting them.

Al you are correct that I shouldn't make fun of you for failed attempts. He who never tries anything, never fails. But, my point is; for YOU who has never found your direction in insurance to be on this forum dishing out advice to others who are MUCH more focused and successful than you like we're "not ready" because we're not as old as you...come on...even YOU have to acknowledge is...simply WRONG.

One last question Al; Who is this Rick guy?

One other last question Al; Are you really going to stick with that "older person" routine? Like Dennys should advertise that all older people get a discount? ...doesn't sound flattering to me but then again...you speak for all older people.

 

[Guest]

Opps! I made an appointment with a woman for next week! Should I become a woman so I can identify with her also Al?

If you don't understand that older women have different concerns than older men, then you might want to do some research into gerontology... perhaps read some of the lay-person books out there about "dealing" with older people... the kinds of books people who regularly work with and around older people read (and write.)

You don't need to be 70 to deal with a 70 year old. Both of my stock brokers are in their 30s. But they have trained themselves (or been trained by E. Jones) on how interact more successfully with older people.

It is the same with older people who deal with young people and mid-life people. We have an advantage because we have been through that stage, but every generation is different, although in many ways they are all the same. That makes no sense, I know, but when you are older and dealing with younger people you will get the picture a bit better. It is a lot easier to sell when your client sees you as an uncle or parent figure than when they see you as a young "whippersnapper" still "wet behind the ears."

Al, my clients appreciate that I deal with FACTS, not opinions.

You've heard it before, I'm sure. People buy on emotion, they justify with logic.

I don't tell anyone that AARP is bad or that they should cancel their membership to AARP.

Well, that's not what you led me to believe earlier.

I point out that they are not usually the best place to buy life insurance and that they are not always the best price on a Medicare Supplement plan. Then I show them the facts.

Hmmm. I'm curious. What is your close-ratio when selling against the AARP? No wrong answer. Just curious. I've never sold against them. I recommend that they join or continue their membership but not buy their insurance until they have talked to me or another agent. That works for me about 75% of the time, but I deal more with LTC, life (out here AARP life is with NYL) and annuities.... and not supps or MA.

Al they like to know these things. In most cases they didn't know HOW to shop for a Med Sup. They just went the easiest route and had a LOT of ads from AARP hitting them.

This is true, but the AARP supps are no better or worse in the long run than any other. An F is an F... and if an F is the 'right' plan for the client, it just comes down to price and UHC (the carrier out here in my area of CA) Clients of mine who have AARP MA seem happy. I don't know anyone who has their supps. All I'm saying is that AARP is not the evil empire that you seem to believe it is. Believe me, I'd take AARP recommended products over what some of the agents on this board would recommend... in a Hollywood minute.

Al you are correct that I shouldn't make fun of you for failed attempts.

Yes, but you got a great deal of satisfaction out of doing so. It is the kind of man you are. You need to work on that part of your personality.

He who never tries anything, never fails.

Have you ever failed? Have you ever tried anything other than insurance? I start out as a teacher... and tended bar at a whore house in 1970.

But, my point is; for YOU who has never found your direction in insurance

Oh dear. I didn't know you were such an expert in psychology or in my particular "case." How does it feel being so smart and so clairvoyant, such that you can tell, without any doubt exactly who on this board has "direction" and who does not? I'd like to know how I can do that. I really would.

No doubt this works well with your clients. Of course you run the risk of having one with more than two working brain cells... and he or she is going to not only know, but tell you... in no uncertain terms... that you are simply and completely... full of crap. (Of course, crap sells. They taught me in law school that "When you don't have the facts, argue the law.")

others who are MUCH more focused and successful than you

Hmmm. And just who are those people on this board? Is it he guys who are so successful that they are afraid to identify themselves? Is it those who boast and brag about it? Is it those who are selling some kind of "system?" Those who have expensive cars, golf clubs, boats, houses? Tell me whom you know on this venue that you can verify that is more successful than you are... or I am.. or anyone else. I'd sure like to know who they are ... and how YOU know.

Son, if you believe the crap that people post here, I feel terribly sorry for your clients... because you are going to sell them the last product that someone pitched you.

You will do well in sales such that when you meet others in this industry that you believe half of what you see and none of what you hear. There is a life-lesson right there. Follow it or not follow it... your choice.

like we're "not ready" because we're not as old as you...come on...even YOU have to acknowledge is...simply WRONG.

I find that most younger agents are simply condescending and patronizing to older people, OR like you they run the opposite direction and believe that they (you) always know what is best for the dumb, stupid, old codger they are sitting in front of. You think that 40 million (that's a fairly large number) of us join the AARP because we just stupid and become pawns of the organization, buying their products on their say-so alone.

I can understand how you can be one or the other. The media portrays older people as idiots and agents here like to have something to "beat up on" when they can't make a sale to an older person... and the AARP is a good target. (Yes, they have their faults, but with a 40 million members, they must be doing something right!)

Newby, you are just like 95% of all the other young agents out there... brash, know-it-all, combative, and with an air of superiority over that of your client. I'm not going to change you but I can tell you how you come across to me...at age 61. I'm sure your "tude" works with a lot of clients, but you would be "murdered" by my upscale and educated friends and clients. I hope you have a good golf game because with your attitude you are not going to sell a $5 million buy-sell deal to a retiring 70 year old owner of a software consulting firm... where I play... if you call him a "senior citizen" ... unless you can either straighten out his hook or fix his stance so that he gets an extra 20 of the tee.

One last question Al; Who is this Rick guy?

Rick is an agent in Encino, CA who has been on this board for a long time. He posts as "greensky" and exhibits a foul mouth, a bad temper, and an angry demeanor... somewhat similar to other atheists that I've known in my life. He has as much right to post here as anyone else, but having done business with him, I can say that he should not be your role model... any more than I should be. Rick likes to kick a$$ here, and he does it rather well... but not quite as well as I do.

One other last question Al; Are you really going to stick with that "older person" routine?

Just ask your clients, "Mike, let me ask something. How do you feel about the term "senior citizen" that the media always refers to people your age as." Sit back and see what they say.

I hate being referred to as a "senior citizen" not because the words are offensive, but because of what the stereotype and image built up by the media portrays. The words "senior citizen" most always are used to describe people who are sick, mentally deficient, and/or who can't take care of themselves. This is often true, but believe it or not a great many of us have the same mental acuity as we did at 40 and are in better BMI shape than most of you guys at 50.

Like Dennys should advertise that all older people get a discount? ...doesn't sound flattering to me but then again...you speak for all older people.

You see, that's the impertinent, brash, and disrespectful "tude" that I'm sure you exhibit with older people. What is wrong with Denny's offering a lower price to people who no longer have the earnings ability of their earlier years? Same with the "early bird" special. They get people into their stores at a time when younger people are just coming home from work or who like to eat later. That's good business. It does not sound flattering to you, because you have not thought it out.

Jane and I never go to early bird but we do go to happy hour often. My 83 year old mother (in N. Palm Beach, FL) often goes to the early bird because she does not like to drive at night and her meds tend to make her tire early in the evening. she has congestive heart failure... it will eventually be her demise... but I'm thankful to have had her around my entire life.

I'm sure you think of me at 61, my wife at 62, my uncle (her brother) at 75, and her at 83 at the dinner table as a group of tottering old fools, unable to hold a fork or speak a full sentence. That is SENIOR CITIZEN for you.

But you would be totally incorrect. My mother is probably the most savvy stock picker on the planet... eats, lives, and breathes the markets and knows a lot about them. My uncle is an expert about anything that has wheels on the road or floats on the water. My wife is a mystery novelist and expert on Australian Shepherds (ring judge quality.) You would not keep up with our dinner table conversations, to say NOTHING of the ensuing arguments.

The only actual fool at the table is me.

Al
Preserve your memories

 

[GreenSky]

You don't need to be 70 to deal with a 70 year old. Both of my stock brokers are in their 30s.

Gee Al, didn't you post awhile ago that you made your own investment decisions? Like when you posted how much cash you had in Countrywide so that people here would think you were successful.

As far as who I am, I know enough about insurance that I wouldn't have put my wife into an inferior MA plan (your words) when reasonably priced med supps were available. You should learn from those younger and wiser than yourself. But then again, I've been told that "Al is unteachable."

I'm sure your lack of insurance knowledge have harmed your few clients. I hope your ignorance doesn't kill someone.

(I've put out the bait...now let's see if Al takes the hook AGAIN.)

Rick

 

[Newby]

Al, you are a hoot!

I do appreaciate you thinking of me as a young wippersnapper. I'm getting less and less of that since I was alive during the Eisenhower administration (you do the math.)

You want to point out how rude and disrespectful I am and others toward you by being rude and disrespectful and spinning our statements to mean anything you want.

Al, let me tell you something...I don't care what people call me. They can call me a senior citizen and think that means I am old and unstable, they can call me a salesman and think that means con-artist, they can call me a motorcyclist and think that means lunatic, they can call me a Christian and think that means a bible-thumper.

All kind of labels have baggage that people attach to them until you prove them wrong. And I think you would find a lot of us would prefer to be called "seniors" than "older people." Maybe your rich buddies at Club Med prefer the older people tag. But I suspect you're wrong and you are annoying them with your swarmy holier-than-thou attitude.

Al, if you look around this forum, I don't think you will see me saying a disrespectful word to anyone except you. And I only address you when you come out from under your rock and try to stir up ****. You are a disgrace to seniors, insurance agents, golfers and Mac users everywhere. I poo-poo in your general direction!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Gee Al, didn't you post awhile ago that you made your own investment decisions? Like when you posted how much cash you had in Countrywide so that people here would think you were successful.

As far as who I am, I know enough about insurance that I wouldn't have put my wife into an inferior MA plan (your words) when reasonably priced med supps were available. You should learn from those younger and wiser than yourself. But then again, I've been told that "Al is unteachable."

I'm sure your lack of insurance knowledge have harmed your few clients. I hope your ignorance doesn't kill someone.

(I've put out the bait...now let's see if Al takes the hook AGAIN.)

Rick

Don't bother AL! He and his buddies like the AARP Med Advantage because they enjoy paying the hospital co-pay for 11-days instead of 5. All that extra cash in their wallet affects their golf swing out there at Turtle Bay.

Shhhhh! If you listen closely, Al is selling a 5-million dollar key man policy to that "older person" while at the same time he comes in 3-under par on the 2nd hole. He IS truely amazing.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Gee Al, didn't you post awhile ago that you made your own investment decisions? Like when you posted how much cash you had in Countrywide so that people here would think you were successful.

As far as who I am, I know enough about insurance that I wouldn't have put my wife into an inferior MA plan (your words) when reasonably priced med supps were available. You should learn from those younger and wiser than yourself. But then again, I've been told that "Al is unteachable."

I'm sure your lack of insurance knowledge have harmed your few clients. I hope your ignorance doesn't kill someone.

(I've put out the bait...now let's see if Al takes the hook AGAIN.)

Rick

Al only deals with Ed Jones himself and that's only because he thinks a higher 12b1 fee adds to his investment.

 

[Guest]

But then again, I've been told that "Al is unteachable."

I hope your ignorance doesn't kill someone.

Rick

You sure as hell did a crappy job on the client I sent you. I can't believe I let you convince me on the phone that you knew anything about FE. While I've had others, asking you for assistance surely was not my brightest moment in this industry.

I'm very "teachable." You taught me one hell of a good lesson.

With your anger management issues and your bad attitude toward anyone who dares disagree with you, you give this industry and all agents a bad name. Guys like you reinforce the widely held stereotype of fast-talking, abusive, hard-sell, combative, insurance agents. Unlike most here, I've done biz with you. I know just what I'm talking about.

Almost every thread you enter ends up in the fight club... and I'm sure this will be no exception. You just can't help yourself. It is not a stretch for anyone to believe that you carry the attitude you exhibit here... into the homes of your older clients and practice the "sell by aggression" tactic that is so tried-and-true in this business. I have no doubt that you are the guy CMS is trying to stamp out. Anyone reading your postings... calling people assholes and expressing your hope that they die soon... would agree.

 

[GreenSky]

Damn it Al, you really have anger issues. I only call certain people assholes because they act like one.

As far as wishing someone would die soon, show me one post where I wished someone would die.

As usual, you spend more time spinning a story rather than facts.

Get some help before you wind up standing on a corner and shaking your fist as cars drive by. You have a real problem getting along with others and you need counseling.

Lastly, I've posted this before but will once again mention that "great" FE lead you gave me. A woman who wanted a proposal for a $10K FE policy for her 45 year old husband. I told her that she pays the premium and when her husband dies she'll get $10K and that instead of sending her information, we should talk in the future. Apparently that wasn't good enough for her, or you. I recommended Oxford, a low priced plan that required a face to face.

But then again you would understand how a professional sells. You've failed at every sales job you've ever had. Sorry, you succeeded in selling your wife a crappy MA plan because you don't have the skills to sell a real policy.

Rick

 

[Dave020]

You sure as hell did a crappy job on the client I sent you. I can't believe I let you convince me on the phone that you knew anything about FE. While I've had others, asking you for assistance surely was not my brightest moment in this industry.

I'm very "teachable." You taught me one hell of a good lesson.

With your anger management issues and your bad attitude toward anyone who dares disagree with you, you give this industry and all agents a bad name. Guys like you reinforce the widely held stereotype of fast-talking, abusive, hard-sell, combative, insurance agents. Unlike most here, I've done biz with you. I know just what I'm talking about.

Almost every thread you enter ends up in the fight club... and I'm sure this will be no exception. You just can't help yourself. It is not a stretch for anyone to believe that you carry the attitude you exhibit here... into the homes of your older clients and practice the "sell by aggression" tactic that is so tried-and-true in this business. I have no doubt that you are the guy CMS is trying to stamp out. Anyone reading your postings... calling people assholes and expressing your hope that they die soon... would agree.

Not that I want to get into the middle of this (I don't), however, I have sent clients to Rick and he has done a very good job for them. They are very complimentary about Rick, his approach, and his product and market knowledge. I will continue to send him clients for services I don't provide (especially for seniors) and would have no hesitation in recommending him. All feedback I have received so far has been very positive about Rick.

 

[Guest]

Damn it Al, you really have anger issues. I only call certain people assholes because they act like one.

Am I angry that this industry holds agents like you up as role models? That's about the extent of it for me. You on the other hand have a long track record here of not just calling others an asshole, but being an asshole. There is simply no one in this venue that can match your level of vituperation. I've tried, but I don't even come close.

As far as wishing someone would die soon, show me one post where I wished someone would die.

You said a number of times that you hoped I'd die "real soon." The posts are there. I'll have to search to find them... but they are there. I'm sure I'm not the only person who remembers them. It was back during the Tom Pick "dannysdad" postings. I'll find them.

Get some help before you wind up standing on a corner and shaking your fist as cars drive by. You have a real problem getting along with others and you need counseling.

You are simply a bad man. There is no other way to say it.

Lastly, I've posted this before but will once again mention that "great" FE lead you gave me.

Bottom line, the way you treated the client, your attitude, your aggressiveness caused her NOT to do biz with you. Since I'm not licensed in AZ I was out of the loop. But I did get her another agent who was able to get her the plan that worked for her. That case alone showed me what a fool I was to trust you. I wonder how many other new agents you have fooled.

But then again you would understand how a professional sells. You've failed at every sales job you've ever had.

I think you mean "wouldn't understand." You should post after the SECOND bloody mary, not the first.

Failing is part of selling. What I totally fail to understand is how, in this day of the internet and easy-to-find recommendations, that old-school, hyper-aggressive agents like you continue to succeed in this business. Maybe it's because you have the Southern CA "Hollywood" aggressiveness that plays so well there. You'd die on the vine up here. I don't know what Encino is like these days (it used to be rather upscale ... I hear it is "changing") but your personality structure would fail quickly in my area.

No one wants to do business with a bad man.

I wonder how you ever got into UCLA in the first place. USC would have been more the school for you and your "tude."

Sorry, you succeeded in selling your wife a crappy MA plan because you don't have the skills to sell a real policy.

My under-age wife does not have high medical bills. She has high drug bills. Her Anthem Freedom One MA plan (zero premium, moderate deduct, and "gold plan" formulary) works fine. A supp would be money wasted in this case. Indeed, plain old Medicare and just a Part D would be fine. Learning is a constant in this business... but that's something you've never learned!

When all you know is how to use a hammer, I'm sure the entire world looks to you like a nail. As usual, you don't know what you don't know... just another reason why I'd never do business with you again.

 

[MedSuppPro]

What we have here -- is the Bubba Effect!



PS Russ, did ya ever think you'd cause WWIII over a freaking AARP $3.50 membership dues increase?