Term Buyer: Need Independent Agent/advise

acinchus · 09-27-2009, 11:06 AM

I am a 34yr old corporate professional with a 31yr old wife and 2 kids, in Dallas-FtWorth area.

Do not have any life insurance besides the base 1x coverage provided by employer.

While I have decided on going with term insurance and coverage (amount and years) for myself and wife, I need advise on how to get independent advise.

These are the following resources I have used so far:
Term4sale.com (Compulife's quote comparison software)
Lifehappens.org (coverage calculation and general education)
Tdi.state.tx.us (Insurers in Texas with market share and complaint info)
Iiaba.net (to find independent agents)

In addition to the iiaba website and term4sales/compulife's 3 agents (turned out to be lead generators), have tried number of
Google searches to find independent agents but have not been able to locate any individual or small firm specializing in life insurance.

Any help or specific agent recommendations in Dallas metro area will be appreciated.

By the way, compulife's term4sale seems to give a good starting point to compare quotes and companies. Any other comparison providers similar to this and any opinion of compulife?

SportsNut · 09-27-2009, 11:21 AM

You should be commended here, as you have found some good resources. Compulife is one of the best, actuallly.

Yes, many of these sites are lead generators, which isn't all bad, since you are looking for an independent advisor/agent anyway.

I would suggest that you check our STIBroker, as he is in your region, and a very knowledgable life ins agent. Also one of the moderators here on this site.

STIBroker contact info here. Scott will give you good advice and be able to provide you objective analysis.

dgoldenz · 09-27-2009, 01:38 PM

Edited post

Robert Barney · 09-27-2009, 02:05 PM

I am curious what you meant by:

"term4sales/compulife's 3 agents (turned out to be lead generators)..."

My understanding of a "lead" is when you provide your personal information to an entity, and where that information is then provided or sold to an agent who contacts you.

The agents at term4sale do not call you, unless you call them first.

Please elaborate. As the guy who owns Compulife, which in turn owns Term4Sale, I am always anxious to get consumer feedback and a public disussion is always good.

Is there a way Term4Sale can do it better?

bluemarlin08 · 09-27-2009, 03:01 PM

I think you do it right. However, I wish there were away to quote second to die as well as put in lump sums and manipulate premiums.

Robert Barney · 09-27-2009, 03:56 PM

Blue,

I would be happy to quote second to die. The problem is that I have not had one company, not ONE company, provide me with the calculations for second to die.

We just added a number of new new no lapse categories. Here is what I wrote in the midmonth bulletin:

6. New Categories Added

September 24th - Our thanks to West Coast and Protective Life who met our challenge to provide no lapse UL premiums for a "to age 65, 70 and 75" scenario. We said that if we got such rates, we would move forward and add "to age 100" and "to age 105" categories.

But West Coast and Protective went above and beyond the call of duty and provided us with a complete range of additional level coverage options in between and above. We have responded by adding all of them to our categories.

Here is the complete list of new categories.

Age 80 Level Guaranteed
Age 85 Level Guaranteed
Age 90 Level Guaranteed
Age 95 Level Guaranteed
Age 100 Level Guaranteed
Age 105 Level Guaranteed
Age 110 Level Guaranteed

You will notice in the category list, these all follow the term categories:

Age 65 Level Guaranteed
Age 70 Level Guaranteed
Age 75 Level Guaranteed

The reason is quite simple. It is possible for your client to outlive the coverage, as the guaranteed premium/coverage ends at the age specified. Policies in the new categories do NOT become paid up at the age specified, they effectively lapse - or at least the guarantee does. So if you sell the age 90 no lapse variation, the guaranteed premium/coverage is gone at 90. If your client is still alive, the policy is over, or will cost a great deal more.

If you are selling these policies to your clients, speculating that your client WILL die before the benefit is paid, then your speculation may backfire. The only way certain to ensure that your client is going to have guaranteed coverage for life, is to go to age 121. And it is surprising how many 121 plans are highly competitive when you select the "pay to 100" option.

Having said all that, premiums are clearly less expensive for ages 100 and 105 and it appears a number of agents, and a number of companies, are recommending these premium/guarantee solutions.

While we don't think it is good idea to speculate about how long you may live (as an outside number), it is not our place to do anything other than warn that your mileage (or in this case mortality) may vary.

And now that we have introduced these new categories, we are more than happy to work with other companies to get their no lapse UL products into those categories.

As I like to say to companies:

"What part of free advertising don't you understand".

And in case you didn't know, Compulife does not charge life companies to add their products to our system. The only time a life company pays Compulife anything is if they subscribe - just like any agency.

And on a final note, Nationwide Life had also given us rates to age 100 and those are in that new category.

LGilmore · 09-27-2009, 06:34 PM

I need advise on how to get independent advise."\

Guys, I think he's looking for a FEE based adviser.

Mr. young professional, is there a reason you don't wish to work with an independent agent who could sell you the policy you need?

*STIBROKER@AUSTIN.RR.COM* · 09-27-2009, 06:39 PM

Call me...512-260-0856.........

xrac · 09-27-2009, 06:58 PM

Originally Posted by acinchus

I am a 34yr old corporate professional with a 31yr old wife and 2 kids, in Dallas-FtWorth area.

Do not have any life insurance besides the base 1x coverage provided by employer.

While I have decided on going with term insurance and coverage (amount and years) for myself and wife, I need advise on how to get independent advise.

These are the following resources I have used so far:
Term4sale.com (Compulife's quote comparison software)
Lifehappens.org (coverage calculation and general education)
Tdi.state.tx.us (Insurers in Texas with market share and complaint info)
Iiaba.net (to find independent agents)

In addition to the iiaba website and term4sales/compulife's 3 agents (turned out to be lead generators), have tried number of
Google searches to find independent agents but have not been able to locate any individual or small firm specializing in life insurance.

Any help or specific agent recommendations in Dallas metro area will be appreciated.

By the way, compulife's term4sale seems to give a good starting point to compare quotes and companies. Any other comparison providers similar to this and any opinion of compulife?

acinchus,

The problem with on-line quotes is rates depend upon underwriting and underwriting varies from company to company. Some companies that give the super preferred low rates are also the most stringent with underwriting and almost no one will qualify for those rates. An experienced agent will now these nuances and which company best fits your needs. For example if you are a tobacco users they will know that Prudential offers some of the best tobacco user rates. My advice would be to look for a solid company, good ratings, and a policy that is convertible to permanent insurance. Convertibility protects you should your health change. Lastly, you don't know what the final rate will be until you go through underwriting. If I were you I would give STI a call.

dgoldenz · 09-27-2009, 07:18 PM

Convertibility these days isn't what it used to be....

xrac · 09-27-2009, 08:53 PM

Originally Posted by dgoldenz

Convertibility these days isn't what it used to be....

What do you mean??? Below is an example of why I preach convertibility:

Originally Posted by BOLIO

........I tried to help an executive with an oil and gas company this week. He is 46, has a 250,000 mortgage on a home that is worth 385,000(very conservative for his income-Suzy would approve).
He was sold a 20 year term policy by an A.L. Williams follower(19 years ago). He was sold term as a commodity. He was sold term that could not be converted and was non-renewable. You know why? Because it was the cheapest.

He has 20 more years in the workforce and 5 kids under the age of 18! He wants more life insurance and would pay 10 times the amount he could have "invested" over the years(which he didn't) on insurance premiums today if he was insurable......

Robert Barney · 09-27-2009, 09:19 PM

Originally Posted by xrac

acinchus,

The problem with on-line quotes is rates depend upon underwriting and underwriting varies from company to company. Some companies that give the super preferred low rates are also the most stringent with underwriting and almost no one will qualify for those rates. An experienced agent will now these nuances and which company best fits your needs. For example if you are a tobacco users they will know that Prudential offers some of the best tobacco user rates. My advice would be to look for a solid company, good ratings, and a policy that is convertible to permanent insurance. Convertibility protects you should your health change. Lastly, you don't know what the final rate will be until you go through underwriting. If I were you I would give STI a call.

www.term4sale.com has a health analyzer option which will let a consumer enter the particulars regarding:

Height/weight
Blood pressure
Cholesterol
Driving record
Family history
Smoking particulars

This will give you a very good idea what products are candidates. There may be other criteria involved, but generally companies work to their published criteria and I have not heard from many that their clients are being rejected having met the fundamental criteria.

dgoldenz · 09-27-2009, 09:19 PM

Originally Posted by xrac

What do you mean??? Below is an example of why I preach convertibility:

A lot of companies are changing their conversion products so that they aren't guaranteed for life, moving back to the 80's-style UL policies. West Coast Life operates this way now for example.

Robert Barney · 09-27-2009, 09:25 PM

If you are a term buyer, with term needs, then convertibility simply means that you can swap the policy for a whole life product. But if you have term needs, how does that solve your problem?

The key is to match the period of your insurance to the period of your need. I discuss that here:

Go Long on Term Life Insurance

A person who is 34, can cover themselves to age 64 with a 30 year term. That is about the maximum period a real term buyer will need the protection given that most people plan to retire at or about that age. Even if they don't (and I don't), they should be planning their savings and investments to be in a position to do so if their health dictates that they can no longer work.

xrac · 09-27-2009, 10:05 PM

Originally Posted by Robert Barney

www.term4sale.com has a health analyzer option which will let a consumer enter the particulars regarding:

Height/weight
Blood pressure
Cholesterol
Driving record
Family history
Smoking particulars

This will give you a very good idea what products are candidates. There may be other criteria involved, but generally companies work to their published criteria and I have not heard from many that their clients are being rejected having met the fundamental criteria.

Many people don't know these numbers and some are in for surprises. No one knows for sure what will come back until the examine is done. Maybe you get a good idea but not always.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Originally Posted by Robert Barney

If you are a term buyer, with term needs, then convertibility simply means that you can swap the policy for a whole life product. But if you have term needs, how does that solve your problem?

The key is to match the period of your insurance to the period of your need. I discuss that here:

Go Long on Term Life Insurance

A person who is 34, can cover themselves to age 64 with a 30 year term. That is about the maximum period a real term buyer will need the protection given that most people plan to retire at or about that age. Even if they don't (and I don't), they should be planning their savings and investments to be in a position to do so if their health dictates that they can no longer work.

What happens when he reaches 64 if he became divorced or widowed, remarried, and has a second young family and still needs protection (I know many guys in this boat). What if there is a surprise baby in his fifties and he still wants coverage? What if he still has a large mortgage at 64 and limited savings (the average 401k is $32,000). What if he is laid off, started a business as a second career and the bank requires him to have coverage due to a business loan.

There are a plethora of contingencies that can exist. I personally think it is worth paying a little extra to have convertibility with a solid company.

Robert Barney · 09-28-2009, 01:10 AM

Originally Posted by xrac

Many people don't know these numbers and some are in for surprises. No one knows for sure what will come back until the examine is done. Maybe you get a good idea but not always.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

What happens when he reaches 64 if he became divorced or widowed, remarried, and has a second young family and still needs protection (I know many guys in this boat). What if there is a surprise baby in his fifties and he still wants coverage? What if he still has a large mortgage at 64 and limited savings (the average 401k is $32,000). What if he is laid off, started a business as a second career and the bank requires him to have coverage due to a business loan.

There are a plethora of contingencies that can exist. I personally think it is worth paying a little extra to have convertibility with a solid company.

Before I address convertibility, can we agree that it is more important for this 34 year old to get a 30 year term, and not a 20 or 10 year term?

xrac · 09-28-2009, 08:11 AM

Originally Posted by Robert Barney

Before I address convertibility, can we agree that it is more important for this 34 year old to get a 30 year term, and not a 20 or 10 year term?

Probably but it is all a matter of personal choice. What does the individual want, what can they afford, and how much risk do they want to take concerning changes in their own health? My philosophy is that some coverage (no matter the term) is better than no coverage.

Full Throttle · 09-28-2009, 09:28 AM

Life doesn't happen in a fixed scientific environment, that's why I'm a fan of convertable term from a carrier offering a solid conversion option (instead of a crappy UL policy no one would buy if they had a choice) even if someone doesn't desire to convert at this time.

*STIBROKER@AUSTIN.RR.COM* · 09-28-2009, 09:46 AM

All this depends on the clients situation.....and goals......call me @ 512-260-0856

acinchus · 09-28-2009, 02:43 PM

Thanks to everyone in making this a discussion. I only checked back this morning and was pleasantly surprised to see 18 posts.

Now to clarify things based on some questions asked:

I am not looking for fee based advisor, just an experienced independent insurance broker who can help me decide from the tons of choices (like the ones Compulife lists).

While I probably need upto $1m coverage and upto $250k for spouse and ideally for 30 yrs (will be close to retirement then), I was thinking of starting off at $500k and $250k for 20yrs (kids should be past college when I am 54) to contain costs. I too believe in having a clause for convertibility to give me option to add more coverage (years or amount) or even change to other types of insurance.

Mr Barney, let me explain my comment about lead generators. For the 3 closest zipcode based listings that is offered (I understand its through auction) on term4sale, none of the 3 were in my area, 1 was 50miles away, 2 in another state. What I was looking for were agents using compulife program in my vicinity (within say 20miles). I tried another zipcode to see if anything changes, but it was the same.

Thanks for referring STIBroker. Scott please PM/email with your background and experience. I will followup with a call sometime this week.