I realize this forum is only viewed by a minority of agents, and I know we have had many conversations about Part C plans.
But if you cannot see by now that we have been pawns then your blind!!!
I'm amazed at the agents waiting with baited breath on CMS and company guidelines, waiting to find what hoops they can or cannot jump through. "ridiculous"
Advantage plans have soured seniors against AGENTS, I know it was mostly because of the acts of many unethical greedy agents. Do you not think that the companies knew what they were doing??? Licensing thousands of new agents, agents that got in the business for the quick buck!
Companies have been speaking out of both sides of their mouths, preaching CMS rules and at the same time encouraging agents to promote and offer the plans at any cost!
Now that companies feel the general population understand or are at least familiar with advantage plans, we agents are really not needed.
We can cold call Med supps, we can mail lead cards, hold seminars all without CMS breathing down our necks!!
I suggest we ban together and market med supps, and battle the Pt c plans in full force!
Keep selling Advantage plans and you will sell yourself out of business!!!!!!!
I don't work the senior market. Have no plans to get in the market.
Is there a problem in "dual" marketing? Soliciting for Med Supp and then offering a choice in MA and Med Supp?
Or is that another CMS no-no?
According to the rules yesterday, {they may have changed today}, if you spoke to prospective cleints about med sups or life insurance, etc., you could not mention MA, MAPD or PDP unless they initiated the conversation.
Even if you made an appoinment with them and were in the home, you could not mention those plans unless they brought it up. If they brought it up, you had to schedule a separate appointment, at least 48 hours later, to go over those plans. The prospective clients also have to sign a form stating that's how it went down.
As I said in another thread, those kinds of ridiculous rules will drive the decent agents out of that market leaving only the rule breakers. What a way to look out for seniors, huh?
You have to set an appt for the MA plan, according to the rules, whatever they may end up being.
This is much ado over nothing. There are some new rules, but if you only sell MA plans for a living you are going to have to look at going back to the things you sold prior to the MA boom, or you are fairly new in the business and you are going to look to adding new things to your product line offerings.
The nature of the enrollment periods surely has forced most professional full time agents to sell other lines after OEP. The folks in real distress are those who jumped on the MA product as a way to make a living and have no other bullets in their gun. For the most part, those are the recent additions to the business, and for the most part, they are the ones who caused the rules to swing as far as they have. Don't take offense if this doesn't apply
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Chuck
If you think your boss is stupid, remember: you wouldn't have a job if he was any smarter.”
Medicare Advantage seems like a piecemeal way to make money anyways. 400-600 an app (1 sold a total of 10 last year) There are many products out there with greater marketing and commission potential.
I had never been in sales until I got into this field. I have been taught and have heard time and time again that with your prospects / clients you should assess their concerns and needs. With that being said if I am at a health expo which is open to people of all ages, I feel that I should be able to offer something to almost everyone that visits my booth. Ind. health plans for those not on Medicare and for those that are Medicare recipients I would like to be able to offer Med supps and Med adv. Not everyone can afford med. supps. Luckily where I sale, med. adv. plans are good options.
I guess we could all go back and forth as to why or not something is good or bad, but I feel what it really boils down to is whether or not it is going to be the best product for your client. Not whether or not I think they are appropriate or if I feel like I am an ins. companies spawn.
I do not agree with CMS' rule in regards to only talking about one product. I like to explain and I try to help those on Medicare understand how everything works. I want them to know all of their options. I have a soft spot in my heart for the elderly and it is so sad how confused these people are. I have helped individuals that qualified for SNP's but their agent had convinced them they needed a med. supp, when in all reality the individual could have been on Medicaid and then on a SNP which would have cost them absolutely nothing. Then at the same time I have helped individuals who had the money to pay med supps. but their agent had convinced them that med. adv. was the way to go when in all actuality due to them needing monthly oxygen, etc, their OOP expenses in monthly premiums for a med. supp. would be less then the OOP max on the med. adv.
So my main concern, like most everyone here, is to let my client know all of their options and help them to make an informed, educated decision that will benefit them. If that means selling an advantage plan so be it, if it means me selling a med supp at a lower paycheck for me, so be it and if it means me telling the client that I have nothing to offer them that would be a benefit to them and me making no commission, then so be it!
I realize this forum is only viewed by a minority of agents, and I know we have had many conversations about Part C plans.
But if you cannot see by now that we have been pawns then your blind!!!
I'm amazed at the agents waiting with baited breath on CMS and company guidelines, waiting to find what hoops they can or cannot jump through. "ridiculous"
Advantage plans have soured seniors against AGENTS, I know it was mostly because of the acts of many unethical greedy agents. Do you not think that the companies knew what they were doing??? Licensing thousands of new agents, agents that got in the business for the quick buck!
Companies have been speaking out of both sides of their mouths, preaching CMS rules and at the same time encouraging agents to promote and offer the plans at any cost!
Now that companies feel the general population understand or are at least familiar with advantage plans, we agents are really not needed.
We can cold call Med supps, we can mail lead cards, hold seminars all without CMS breathing down our necks!!
I suggest we ban together and market med supps, and battle the Pt c plans in full force!
Keep selling Advantage plans and you will sell yourself out of business!!!!!!!
Yep, I couldn't agree more. I have never liked the PFFS plans from the first time I heard about them. I have only sold two and converted those two to a Med Supp several months later.
We are being used and abused by CMS, the companies and marketers. I didn't get in this business to be somebody's butt boy or have to check with "mommy or daddy" before I picked up the phone or had a conversation with someone.
There may be a place for HMO's and PPO's. When that was all that was available none of these problems existed.
Enter the PFFS plans with huge, unrealistic commissions and every Fuller Brush and encyclopedia salesman saw an opportunity to "get rich". All they brought with them was greed, not knowledge, not ethical practices, not concern for their clients but only a strong desire to do and/or say whatever it takes to get that all important commission check.
The public didn't think very much about insurance agents before all this crap started and now we are even several feet lower than whale shiet.
And, I'm holding back.
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Medicare Supplement Sales Training and Coaching.
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877.633.0808
Yep, I couldn't agree more. I have never liked the PFFS plans from the first time I heard about them. I have only sold two and converted those two to a Med Supp several months later.
I do not like these plans either. I have never sold one and never will. I do not take the certification classes for these plans. I called to make sure that not taking the classes would not hold other commissions, etc. and they said it does not, so I never even take those tests. Where I am located I have only ran across one person that was enrolled in a PFFS, they are not really marketed I guess since the MAPDs and SNPs have great network and coverage.
All you have to do is go to one of those MA FMO or Mandatory Corporate meetings the insurance companies hold, look around at your peers, and you should see that the professional pedestal we put ourselves on has been lowered a couple of feet. If you think you are in good company at those meetings, I apologize for the insult. I can only imagine what kind of crowd attends the viatical and final settlement meetings.
All you have to do is go to one of those MA FMO or Mandatory Corporate meetings the insurance companies hold, look around at your peers, and you should see that the professional pedestal we put ourselves on has been lowered a couple of feet. If you think you are in good company at those meetings, I apologize for the insult. I can only imagine what kind of crowd attends the viatical and final settlement meetings.
You are onto something here, Chuck. The view is somewhat different for PFFS-only crowds versus the complete MA crowd IMHO. I noticed a complete difference in the IFP-only meeting I went to this summer, but then again, it was for one specific carrier. Each group has its own mindset.
I am glad that I demanded to sell Med Sups as well as MAs when I started out, and am very well pleased at the progress I have made in understanding the health insurance industry by expanding into IFP and Group this year.
By having a complete picture of marketing health insurance, it helps the clients I serve in specific markets. Those agents who only have a limited view of health insurance by virtue of product specific focused sales, will not be able to appreciate this. I encourage other agents to broaden their perspective.
I want to address another post while I'm at it. Yes, the carriers know what they are breeding. I observed one local carrier promote a group that I knew to be one of the worst non-compliant offenders in the MA arena. This little group started out with an organizer that taught his group how to "sneak up on seniors". He was the quintessential offender, and his bread and butter company knew it. I know this because I discussed it with a senior company official. Nothing came of it.
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To be truly independent, an agent should not be dependent on a government bureaucrat for contracts or commissions.
I realize this forum is only viewed by a minority of agents, and I know we have had many conversations about Part C plans.
But if you cannot see by now that we have been pawns then your blind!!!
I'm amazed at the agents waiting with baited breath on CMS and company guidelines, waiting to find what hoops they can or cannot jump through. "ridiculous"
Advantage plans have soured seniors against AGENTS, I know it was mostly because of the acts of many unethical greedy agents. Do you not think that the companies knew what they were doing??? Licensing thousands of new agents, agents that got in the business for the quick buck!
Companies have been speaking out of both sides of their mouths, preaching CMS rules and at the same time encouraging agents to promote and offer the plans at any cost!
Now that companies feel the general population understand or are at least familiar with advantage plans, we agents are really not needed.
We can cold call Med supps, we can mail lead cards, hold seminars all without CMS breathing down our necks!!
I suggest we ban together and market med supps, and battle the Pt c plans in full force!
Keep selling Advantage plans and you will sell yourself out of business!!!!!!!
Exactly ! We agents have been the boots on the ground that were deployed from CMS on a mandate from the Bush Administration to privatize Medicare .We went house to house in hand to hand combat against the resistence (old farts who heard that HMOs and PPOs where bad ) and now that resistance is waining they will start withdrawing troops after this final AEP surge.
But we should be proud because they couldn't have privatized Medicare without us - the good and bad soldiers alike !
I don't think I have been promoting Medicare as a National Health Plan.... anymore than Social Security as a National Retirement Plan. It is a social safety net that we all have paid into for many, many years.
Medicaid is a bird of another feather.
The National Health Plan being touted by NObama is going to turn entitlements into "rights".... In my view, you pay for entitlements through payroll contributions, rights are established by government edict. This healthcare plan by the Dems is an attempt to make Medicaid the rule for everyone, not Medicare.
Michellea, If a retiree qualifies for Medicaid you cannot sale them a med supp..
Medicaid is state run and in Georgia I really don't see a benefit in enrolling a Medicaid recipient into a SNP other than making a quick buck
Remember every state is different in regards to their benefits. I know I have spoken with Rick and he said that in California Medicaid recipiants get more benefits then they do on a SNP plan. Here in Alabama is is just the opposite. Individuals on Medicaid receive better doctors, larger network to specialists, etc., more benefits, etc. when enrolled in a SNP plan.
Individuals who are RECEIVING medical assistance benefits from the Medicaid Agency, such as regular
Medicaid or QMB benefits, are not eligible to purchase supps,
BUT
There are many individuals who may QUALIFY for these benefits, yet are not receiving them and they are on supplement plans or could purchase a plan if they wanted to.
The following is something I copied from a BCBS C+ app. and it is information required by federal regulations:
(c) You may be eligible for benefits under Medicaid and may not need a Medicare supplement policy.
(d) If, after purchasing this policy, you become eligible for Medicaid, the benefits and premiums under your Medicare supplement policy can be suspended, if requested, during your entitlement to benefits under Medicaid for 24 months. You must request this suspension within 90 days of becoming eligible for Medicaid. If you are no longer entitled to Medicaid, your suspended Medicare supplement policy (or,
If that is no longer available, a substantially equivalent policy) will be reinstituted if requested within 90 days of losing Medicaid eligibility. If the Medicare supplement policy provided coverage for outpatient prescription drugs and you enrolled in Medicare Part D while your policy was suspended, the reinstituted policy will not have outpatient prescription drug coverage, but will otherwise be substantially
equivalent to your coverage before the date of the suspension.
My whole point is that regardless of what you sale; supps, adv. plans, life ins., car ins., etc. you should do what is right for the client. What will adress your clients needs and priorities the most.
I will never forget this client that I really learned from when I first started selling. She was on an advantage plan and wanted to see about the plan I was selling. After talking to her I knew it would be a done deal because #1 she was paying a small monthly premium and our plan did not have a premium; #2 our OOP max was considerably less then her plan; and #3 my plans drug formulary covered drugs that were not covered with her current formulary. Towards the end of the meeting she cut me off and informed me that she would have to think about it and wanted to talk to a friend. I could not believe it. We ended up talking a few more minutes and I mentioned something about the Silversneakers plan that was an added benefit. As soon as that came out of my mouth she said she wanted to enroll right then. I could not believe it. I learned then that being in sales we learn product. We learn why our product or services are better then others and that is what we "sale" but in all reality some of that does not even matter, because in the end it all depends on what the prospect thinks is important!
I don't think I have been promoting Medicare as a National Health Plan....
This healthcare plan by the Dems is an attempt to make Medicaid the rule for everyone, not Medicare.
I think you're getting your plans a bit confused.
Obama's plan has been very clear that he wants to make the FEHBP the plan for everyone... Clinton actually started us down this road after Hillary blew-up her heatlh care coalition a decade ago.
FEHBP - Federal Employee Health Benefit Plan
------------------------------------ [COLOR=blue]I am not a vegetarian because I hate meat... I'm a vegetarian because I hate plants![/COLOR]
Obama's plan has been very clear that he wants to make the FEHBP the plan for everyone... Clinton actually started us down this road after Hillary blew-up her heatlh care coalition a decade ago.
FEHBP - Federal Employee Health Benefit Plan
I know the difference, I just don't think NOBama does.
Are Your Eyes Open Yet?
All you have to do is go to one of those MA FMO or Mandatory Corporate meetings the insurance companies hold, look around at your peers, and you should see that the professional pedestal we put ourselves on has been lowered a couple of feet. If you think you are in good company at those meetings, I apologize for the insult. I can only imagine what kind of crowd attends the viatical and final settlement meetings. 
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