- 1,271
Fate is against you. There is absolutely nothing wrong with doing what you mentioned as that plan is exactly what you're looking for. WL is NOT what you're looking for (don't you get it?).
Looking For a Whole Life Policy
- Thread starter stevew7
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- disability whole life
Fate is against you. There is absolutely nothing wrong with doing what you mentioned as that plan is exactly what you're looking for. WL is NOT what you're looking for (don't you get it?).
- 4,132
Fish on. 
I'm confused by how you knew the cash values from the "quote" given over the phone. Further, I'd be interested to know what 800 number you called at SBLI and got an agent to talk to. My experience calling them is you get a voice mail box that never gets listened to as I've called them a few times on a few different issues and never get immediate resolutions.
Are they too small? Define too small. They are tiny compared to most of the others. They are popular around here having the regional thing going for them, so doesn't Massmutual.
My underwriting experience with them is what they tell you you probably qualify and what you actually qualify for can vary quite a bit. They are by no means a bad company.
Are they too small? Define too small. They are tiny compared to most of the others. They are popular around here having the regional thing going for them, so doesn't Massmutual.
My underwriting experience with them is what they tell you you probably qualify and what you actually qualify for can vary quite a bit. They are by no means a bad company.
- 1,641
Still a good thread, if too much attention to irr.
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- #85
I called the toll free number on their website (1-888-438-7254) during lunch and was connected with a live representative in SBLI Rhode Island office. He asked me some qualifying questions to estimate my underwriting class (family history, height, weight, etc) and then I asked about 10 pay policies with PUAs. After some back and forth, he said they don't offer a PUA rider (like Guardian) and the best he could do is make the dividends purchase PUAs. I thought this was going to be a useless call, but asked him for a 10 pay with 750K DB, and then I asked him what the CV was going to be in the first year. When he said a number that was more than my first year's payment, I then asked him to email me the illustration, along with a 15 pay illustration with the same DB, specimen policy, and dividend history. I had the illustrations in a few minutes, and the other info by the end of the day. The total call probably lasted 20 minutes.[/quote]
I've attached the illustration if it is helpful.
Thanks to everyone for all the insight.
slick_spe3
New Member
- 15
I'm with Larry and think that we've been hooked, but what the heck....
Steve,
You read my thread. I'm an engineer and asked a TON of questions both on my thread and over e-mail. I used BNTRS as my agent for a 10-Pay blended policy from Guardian. He was absolutely great to work with and I would recommend him to anyone. I learned a lot about WL and I'm almost dangerous with what I know.
My problem is your beating the dead horse of IRR. Why do you care so much about the "early year" IRR? My early year "paper" wealth is really not a critical factor for me. What dividend rate will the SBLI policy have in Policy Year 32? Guaranteed? What will the Dow be in the year 2027? Who has the crystal ball?
Our situations are very similar, but you have to decide on a strategy. Chasing IRR is NOT a strategy; in fact, you'll drive yourself crazy and end up disappointed. Policy construction, PUA treatment, company financial strength and your own personal financial strategy are much more important.
Remember that wealth has three phases: Accumulation, Distribution and Preservation. How does your financial strategy impact each of those? Like BNTRS told me once about money for retirement, it's not about how much you have, it's about how much you can spend. Think about that.
Slick
Steve,
You read my thread. I'm an engineer and asked a TON of questions both on my thread and over e-mail. I used BNTRS as my agent for a 10-Pay blended policy from Guardian. He was absolutely great to work with and I would recommend him to anyone. I learned a lot about WL and I'm almost dangerous with what I know.
My problem is your beating the dead horse of IRR. Why do you care so much about the "early year" IRR? My early year "paper" wealth is really not a critical factor for me. What dividend rate will the SBLI policy have in Policy Year 32? Guaranteed? What will the Dow be in the year 2027? Who has the crystal ball?
Our situations are very similar, but you have to decide on a strategy. Chasing IRR is NOT a strategy; in fact, you'll drive yourself crazy and end up disappointed. Policy construction, PUA treatment, company financial strength and your own personal financial strategy are much more important.
Remember that wealth has three phases: Accumulation, Distribution and Preservation. How does your financial strategy impact each of those? Like BNTRS told me once about money for retirement, it's not about how much you have, it's about how much you can spend. Think about that.
Slick
Bluefin646
Expert
- 41
Gents,
a friend has been trying to convince me that wl for kids; 9, 6, & 4, is better than 529 plan. lets forget idea of 529 only being indexed. lets say you could get 3% annually, ie money mkt, for comparisons sake. i am looking for pros and cons. thx gents.
a friend has been trying to convince me that wl for kids; 9, 6, & 4, is better than 529 plan. lets forget idea of 529 only being indexed. lets say you could get 3% annually, ie money mkt, for comparisons sake. i am looking for pros and cons. thx gents.
- 15,041
Currently, whole life cash value is not reported on the FASFA, so it can help in eligiblity for financial aid. Also, whole life has guaranteed returns, and its cash value will not go backwards. Just imagine if your kids were entering college in 2007 and 2008. Would you have wanted to redeem your investments in the 529 in that market?
What if you could address this with your own life insurance needs and some of your own retirement needs?
Remember that discussion about dividends being paid regardless of loan balances?
The 529 plan says, save up the money, kid(s) go to college and I pull the ripcord and boom, money's gone. I think I reference already in this thread somewhere you finance everything you buy, either by paying interest to someone else, or giving it up on what you remove from your own personal assets.
So let me bounce this hypothetical off you. The money goes into the WL policy instead of the 529 plan. Kid(s) go to college, you take policy loans to pay for it. Kid(s) graduate and you begin repaying the loan (remember that idea championed by the financial TV/radio gurus where the kids are gone--no longer a liability according to D. Ramsey--and you know have more money, that ramp up period). Now instead of losing all the interest you would have earned on the assets you spent the last 20 years building, you can continue to make that money work for you. You ever have a financial person talk to you about saving money now, vs. 5, 10, 15 etc. years from now.
Larry likes to talk about this idea a lot, dumping the money for good vs. taking the money out for a ride and then putting it back.
Don't buy it on the kids for this purpose, completely ass backwards approach, if you die the policy on the kid doesn't pay a death benefit (to be clear, life insurance policies on children has a definite place, but this is not that place).
I bet blended 10 pay would work real well for this as well
Remember that discussion about dividends being paid regardless of loan balances?
The 529 plan says, save up the money, kid(s) go to college and I pull the ripcord and boom, money's gone. I think I reference already in this thread somewhere you finance everything you buy, either by paying interest to someone else, or giving it up on what you remove from your own personal assets.
So let me bounce this hypothetical off you. The money goes into the WL policy instead of the 529 plan. Kid(s) go to college, you take policy loans to pay for it. Kid(s) graduate and you begin repaying the loan (remember that idea championed by the financial TV/radio gurus where the kids are gone--no longer a liability according to D. Ramsey--and you know have more money, that ramp up period). Now instead of losing all the interest you would have earned on the assets you spent the last 20 years building, you can continue to make that money work for you. You ever have a financial person talk to you about saving money now, vs. 5, 10, 15 etc. years from now.
Larry likes to talk about this idea a lot, dumping the money for good vs. taking the money out for a ride and then putting it back.
Don't buy it on the kids for this purpose, completely ass backwards approach, if you die the policy on the kid doesn't pay a death benefit (to be clear, life insurance policies on children has a definite place, but this is not that place).
I bet blended 10 pay would work real well for this as well
I think that a good WL policy is much better vehcile for educational savings than any 529 plan. There are several advantages:
1)Money can be used for any purpose it doesn't have to be spent on just education.
2)The money in a WL policy does not count on the FASFA. If one had $100,000 sitting in a WL policy it will not matter. If one has $100,000 in a 529 it is going to hurt you in the financial aid game.
3)The money can be accessed at anytime with no taxes or penalties if money is taking out as a policy loan.
4)If the policy holder dies prematurely the WL is self funding (think death benefit). The 529 will never be completed. Its funding source has now been lost.
5)WL has no market risk and market timing is not a concern as it can be with a 529 invested in mutual funds.
6)If you are saving for a child and that child were to die or decide not to go to college the 529 would still need to be spent on somebody for education unless you want to incur a penalty. WL can be used as you see fit.
These are just the advantages I can think of off the top of my head.
1)Money can be used for any purpose it doesn't have to be spent on just education.
2)The money in a WL policy does not count on the FASFA. If one had $100,000 sitting in a WL policy it will not matter. If one has $100,000 in a 529 it is going to hurt you in the financial aid game.
3)The money can be accessed at anytime with no taxes or penalties if money is taking out as a policy loan.
4)If the policy holder dies prematurely the WL is self funding (think death benefit). The 529 will never be completed. Its funding source has now been lost.
5)WL has no market risk and market timing is not a concern as it can be with a 529 invested in mutual funds.
6)If you are saving for a child and that child were to die or decide not to go to college the 529 would still need to be spent on somebody for education unless you want to incur a penalty. WL can be used as you see fit.
These are just the advantages I can think of off the top of my head.
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