MM vs NWM

[LWilliams]

Hello to all,
I am a new agent that has had some experience with final expense insurance sales and Primerica. I have recently interviewed with MM and NWM. I have done some digging around on this forum and haven't been able to find any recent information about these companies and how agents would rate their experience with working with either. The most recent information I've been able to find is from about 5yrs ago. Can anyone offer me any feedback about their experience with either company and if I should join on with them? I am looking at both firms in Denver, CO.

 

[scagnt83]

Not much has changed with either in 5 years. (in regards to their career agent program at least)

MM has better products imo. But its like comparing BMW and Mercedes against each other.

Your individual experience will vary based on the management within that office. Go with the one you feel will provide the most support/structure/training. Both have rock solid products. Your training/support is what will make or break you.

 

[LWilliams]

Not much has changed with either in 5 years. (in regards to their career agent program at least)

MM has better products imo. But its like comparing BMW and Mercedes against each other.

Your individual experience will vary based on the management within that office. Go with the one you feel will provide the most support/structure/training. Both have rock solid products. Your training/support is what will make or break you.

Thank you very much! Sound advice

 

[DecisionMan]

Agreed. Not much has changed. I posted on this about 5 years ago if I remember.

NWM is more of a cult atmosphere where they think there are no other products in the world other than NWM. And if you leave the cult, you leave your renewals as well. I know a lot of great agents there that would love to leave, but they stayed too long.

Both have good training programs, but MM is more of a white-collar market. Finding clients is much different than FE or the senior market.

Having started at Pru many years ago, I wish I had started in the senior market first. I might not have ever left the senior market, but if I left to go to MM I would have been a much better agent because you see what happens to people later in life when they didn't make the insurance purchase earlier in life.

I think the senior market helps someone get started and stay in the business, vs the typical clients of MM and NWM and the other biggies. Once I went to the very nice 3 day training for MM and I remember them saying that 3 of every 100 agents are in the business after 3 years.

The senior market probably has a better success rate. Quicker sales, quicker commissions, quicker turn-time on sales vs large life and annuity that take weeks to setup, and weeks to process even after the app.

You mention you have FE and Primerica experience. If those were together, I'd suggest getting with one of the FE experts in the Forums and try them out for a while and leave Primerica behind. Get some better habits and training in FE and see how it goes.

If you go to MM and NWM there's a big chance you'll make no money, get wiped out, and be out of this fantastic industry. No offense, just commenting on what I've personally witnessed.

 

[LWilliams]

Thank you. You bring up some solid points.
I like the senior market, but I would also like to be able to offer clients a more comprehensive product. I don’t mind being an insurance agent, but would ultimately like to be more of an adviser. I have a passion for being able to help educate, and then offer products and solutions that will hopefully put them and their families in a better situation. Which is why I’m exploring other companies with more then a FE product. A lot to think about here. I definitely don’t want to get “wiped out”.

 

[DHK]

It's not about the product. It's about how you help people to solve problems, make informed decisions, and set proper priorities.

When my prospecting training webinar recording is sent out - you'll want to see it.

 

[DHK]

Btw, if you ONLY have to compare between MM and NWM... Mass - hands down.

Why? You can leave them and still service your business and get referrals. Can't do that with NWM.

Also, "word on the street" is that if the client takes a loan against their policy... the agent's renewals are affected. That would interfere with the way I'd prefer to advise clients on how and why to buy whole life insurance.

I would highly recommend that you get the "Confessions of a CPA" series of books by Bryan Bloom, CPA. Excellent reading material - particularly the Capital Equivalent Value of Life Insurance. That book ranks just a notch or two below Solomon Huebner's work on The Economics of Life Insurance and Nelson Nash's work on the Infinite Banking Concept.

 

[scagnt83]

Btw, if you ONLY have to compare between MM and NWM... Mass - hands down.

Why? You can leave them and still service your business and get referrals. Can't do that with NWM.

I believe that is only after staying at Mass a certain amount of years. I could certainly be wrong or it could have changed.

On the flip side, NWM has one of the highest success rates for new agents in the industry. And imo, generally speaking, one of the best training programs. They really emphasize the "business owner" mindset. Yes, its ironic that you are very handcuffed to them, but we all know that is the mindset needed to succeed long term.

But Ive also heard about NWM offices with terrible management and horrible agent success rates. Thats why I say trust your gut and go with what seems to be the best management and training system. But generally speaking, NWM has very solid training and a higher new agent success rate vs. their peers. I think NWM sees something like a 40% success rate from what Ive heard... but they are also quicker to cut you loose... and overhead will be more with NWM after year 1.

 

[DHK]

You and I have both mentioned this that the office itself would be a higher deciding factor than the company.

One of my friends from high school is a district manager for NWM in Beverly Hills. He is quite successful and helps his agents very well too. I would trust HIM... while not putting too much faith & credit in the company itself.

 

[scagnt83]

@LWilliams DHK makes an excellent point about length of the sales process with the clientele that mutual carriers target. Especially with the type of sales they target.

The most successful new agents I saw at NYL concentrated on simple term sales. They sold very few WL policies in their first 2-3 years, it was 99% term. To a lesser extent, some focused on simple annuity sales targeting CD money with MYGAs. Both are simple concepts that are easy for both client and agent to understand. They close quick and you get paid a lot quicker vs. complicated products/situations.


Since you are not brand new to the industry. Why not consider being an independent agent? If you want to provide the best possible solution to clients, that is the only way to do it. No one single carrier will be the best fit for all, or even most of your clients.

That is the main reason I left NYL... there was almost always a better price/rate/etc. vs. what I could provide..... I still made sales, but it certainly did not give me a warm fuzzy feeling knowing I could cut their term premium by $50 a month by using a different carrier. Those sales are made on the "brand" not the product. If you can convince yourself that MM or NWM is the absolute best regardless of price... then you will sleep fine and do fine... but they are by no means the absolute best... so I couldnt stay in that environment. Not to mention the amount of term sales I lost y1 to competitors who were A+ rated and 50% cheaper.

The same will be true with MM & NWM. Whole Life will be the only product that is actually competitive compared to the overall market. The only way to rationally believe you are doing the "best thing" for your clients is if you honestly believe that carriers is better than all the others regardless of price. (others have the same product features as well)


So why not just go indy? MM has an independent agent contract, you dont have to be a Mass Agent to sell them. Plus you can offer Penn, Guardian, Ohio National, and other mutual carriers. NWM is literally about the only major mutual you wont be able to sell as an indy agent... and I dont know of any indy agents that would actually want to sell their products.

Indy allows you to control your business. You can go after the more complex markets, but still go after the simple markets as well to keep the bills paid month to month (simple could mean term, fe, medicare, MYGAs, etc.). And you will know you are doing right by your clients by shopping the market to provide the best product for their individual situation.

There is plenty of training out there these days if you look hard enough. You dont really "need" a career shop to train you. And working from a home office is not a turn off to most clients like a lot of new agents think it is (you can lease cheap meeting space by the hour in most cities, or even use the free conference rooms your local library provides, or just use a coffee shop). I personally do most of my sales these days over the phone via e-apps, even in my own town.

I used to be a big advocate of starting at a big mutual career shop to get training, then moving to indy after 3 years. Not so much anymore. The industry has changed too much. Its an antiquated system that is not in favor of the client or in favor of a new agents success.