Physician Speaks Out, Be Very Scared!

[GreenSky]

Interesting that you never read the Grapes of Wrath because it took place where you live... in fact I'll bet where your house is now is were the Joads picked fruit.

Enlightened self-interest? Isn't that what you libber-taries call it? Enlightened, my ass!

Al -

You love to name drop, book drop, talk about how you were there when Medicare began, etc.

However, I have come to understand that you have no freaking idea what you are talking about.

Take a few minutes and try to believe statistics that show that minimum wage costs jobs. Is it better to have 8 people employed or 10? In your view, apparently it's better have the fewer employed at higher wages. Very liberal of you. When was the last time you earned minimum wages?

Minimum was is a STARTING wage. It's not meant to be a maximum. If you raise the minimum for unskilled by $1, then it has to follow that the next level goes up by $1 - and so on and so on. Think that has a positive effect on business?

I'm not a neo-con but a libertarian and proud of it. I'm for personal responsibility and freedom.

Getting back to healthcare, there are not 50 million that can't get insurance. It's about 3-5 million citizens. While that's a large number, it's about 1-2% of our population.

Isn't it wonderful that the government wants to limit our choice of insurance, doctors, etc. to take care of such a small percentage?

Al, I've tried very hard not to attack you personally and you've been pretty good about doing the same for me. But it's time you stopped attacking everyone else you disagree with. I can picture you as a fascist dictator screaming "off with their heads." Calm the f*ck down!

Here's my attack. Al, you ARE an ignorant slut.

Rick

 

[GreenSky]

Al, no matter what I say you spin it to suit you needs. You can't allow someone to make a statement such as "the sun can cause sunburn" without accusing them of being a vampire.

No offense, but you're just not worth my time.

You won't get it because you simply don't care to.

I have two requests. First, try to make a point without labels, name calling, etc. You lose all credibility. You can't sell insurance by saying the other companies suck. You can't make a point by putting others down.

My second request is that when you realize that your socialist tendencies have contributed to the downfall of freedom that you don't bitch about it. You got your wish; unfortunately all of us have to live with it.

Rick

 

[Winter_123]

Al and all the the other California libs advocate minimum wage increases but at the same time they are Open Border wackos that promote a massive supply of cheap labor that continually drives wages and benefits down. The employee at the lowest rung can be replaced in a heartbeat, if not already, by someone who came over the border last night.

The gal who makes the beds and cleans the toilets at the Holiday Inn in Sacramento most likely is a contract worker who works for a staffing agency. If she is an employee then there are few benefits and little or no bargaining power because she can be replaced tomorrow by an undocumented worker. Holiday Inn may claim that they dont hire undocumented but then they have ten people show up who are working for the "staffing agency." If they are working on the lawn care crew, we can just assume they are undocumented even if it is in Connecticut. So when the low-level wage person wants to seek/expect a pay increase he is competing with Mexico and Guatamala rates.

Meanwhile, the libs in California support all sorts of spiffy pro-worker legislation on the surface. The reality is that they and the other Open Border wackos have created a whole new class of serfs who are not only exploited but drive wages down for everyone else. Thus the libs have ruined the chances of upward mobility for the poorest of the poor in this country by supporting a continual influx of coolie labor.

The traditional lib response: Well we would not have this problem if the United States created jobs and improved the economy of every government from Texas down to Tierra Del Fuego at the tip of South America. Nice, real nice.

 

[djs]

Al -

It's obvious you don't understand what a neo-con is, since you use the term almost to describe ultra conservativism, and then also try to use the term as an insult (which it isn't).

For todays lesson, a neo-con traditionally has meant (and I'll quote):

Historically, 30 years ago it meant a former liberal who became a conservative. The cliche was because "they were mugged by reality," but it was because they saw the empirical failures of liberal welfare, state and foreign policies, and they were therefore less ideological than other conservatives and brought much more of a social science background to their argumentation.

Yes, this probably does describe a lot of people on this board, though I'm not sure they started out as liberals. You may soon become a neo-con based on this definition.

Okay, a more modern definition of neo-con, and again, I'll quote:

Neoconservatives are less skeptical of government than other conservatives. They are less worried about reducing the size of government, less enthusiastic about tax cuts, more concerned about forging national crusades that can tap either the American public's patriotism or its desire for reform. You saw this in McCain with his campaign finance proposal and a little bit in his foreign policy.

This probably doesn't describe to many people on this board. It does, unfortunately, describe the reason republicans lost control of congress.

If you are going to use terms, please use them correctly. Winter is not a neo-con, I'm not, most here are not.

Dan

P.S. In case you are wondering, these general definitions are pretty common, but I quoted them from: So, what is a 'neocon'? - Pittsburgh Tribune-Review

 

[Winter_123]

If you are going to use terms, please use them correctly. Winter is not a neo-con, I'm not, most here are not.

Dan

Not to be a difficult child here (as you noted the term was not intended to be an insult) I actually would be your classic neo-con within the meaning you offered but not within the definitions the libs intend as a slur.

I have been involved with, implemented, and managed far, far more lib programs than Al ever dreamed of even with his constant nickel-bag high. Al knows me better than I know myself and says this is not true and actually that is perfectly fine. Not to take away from the glamor but I also grew up shoveling cow **** in the morning and working in the cotton mill after school. Al might break a nail if he did that. Best to stay with analyzing the political rhethoric of the Kingston Trio. One thing about the libs, when all the talk is said and done, the sight of the proletariat is actually repugnant to them. You hold up a machine screw and wood screw and I have ten bucks that says they can't tell the difference.

Of course I did not single-handedly free the prisoners at Aushwitz, implement Medicare, and hold Rosa Park's hand as she got on the bus as Al did. What a guy.

 

[Dave020]

Francois Guizot:

"Not to be a republican at twenty is proof of want of heart; to be one
at thirty is proof of want of head."

 

[bobson]

I disagree. For example, if it takes 10 people to run a shift at McDonald's then it takes 10 people. If doesn't work with 6, 5 or 4.

McDonald's would be a perfect example of a company that would be paying $2/hr saying "hey, at least we're offering them a job." And what would McDonald's be doing with the difference between the $2/hr they'd pay and the $7 they have to pay? Cheaper food? No, more money for top execs. Let's get real.

I live in a small rural town in a rural state. The McDonald's in my town was paying $7.00 an hour back to start when the minimum wage was $5.50. They also pay students bonuses for A's. They even have a scholarship program for college students. McDonalds has built its business on service. You don't deliver good service for $2.00 an hour. Now every *** high school student demands $7.50 an hour whether or not they show up for their shift.

 

[GreenSky]

Example of why minimum wage sucks:

Business owner needs his fence painted. He must pay $7.50 per hour due to minimum wages for a very unskilled job.

A handicapped man shows up and says that he'll do the job for $5.00 per hour because he realizes that due to his physical limitations, it will take longer.

If they strike an agreement, the employer can be sued by the government for violating the minimum wage law. So this poor guy who is willing to work for less cannot have a job.

Doesn't have to be this situation. If I'm willing to work for $5 an hour, why is it I am not allowed to do this? Since I don't have the skills necessary to paint the fence and find someone willing to pay me $7.50, I guess it's better that I simply earn nothing. Well, at least I get paid by the taxpayers for not working.

In the past we only regulated minimum wages. Now we are regulating maximium wages paid in various industries. Can you say socialism?

Rick

 

[Crabcake Johnny]

Not the case, you can hire that person to paint your fence 1099 and simply pay him a flat fee for the job.

 

[djs]

In this case, you MIGHT get by with a 1099, but that isn't true in a lot of cases. McDonalds can't pay with 1099's, Walmart can't, and I can't.

Once you tell someone how to do their job, or tell them when to work on the job, or provide the tools for the job, or tell them where they have to work, it's pretty much a W-2 situation. I know you can push the envelope a bit, maybe a lot if you are small, but you do have to be careful with using 1099's to individuals.

Dan