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Nobleviewinsure
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How much more of a risk do you think going with a certificate over a policy creates? Thanks for the response as well!
RNA vs GCU vs KSKJ
- Thread starter Nobleviewinsure
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None. None of these major Fraternal’s that operate in the final expense states have had any operational issues. In fact only on this website that people discuss this as an actual issue.
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It's good to be the king.
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There is always a certain amount of risk. Companies put safe guards, like Maintenance of Reserves, for a reason. However, the overall risk is low. But have much larger companies failed? Yes of course.
There was a popular agent here that said something like "all things being equal he would pick a policy". At the time he was a big RNA producer. I agree. Do I write Fraternals? Sure, usually for underwriting reasons or if there is just to big of a price difference like Son for GI. But if a client can pass the underwriting and the premium is close why add the additional risk. Even if the client is not aware of it.
You asked about the three Fraternals, And said fully underwritten, mentioned RNA preferred, a family member and you would be the bene. Of those three I would pick RNA because of less risk of financial issues or of being sold or absorbed by a larger Fraternal. And I have had good experience with their customer service.
At the end of the day you are talking about the same premium with an $8 to $12. Max difference.
Out of curiosity, what is the age and face amount we are talking?
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Nobleviewinsure
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So essentially the Fraternals are smaller with smaller reserves which makes them slightly more likely to be unable to pay death claims or be solvent? Thanks again this client is in Ohio female 65 smoker no major health issues just depression and arthritis. $25000 face amount
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Not saying that at all.
Many of the FE companies we write here are small enough to fit in the broom closet of the major Life Insurance companies. And we write them daily. We own them. What I am saying is 'all things being equal' why add an additional risk. I have written RNA and KSKJ (term'd for non production). If you are looking at financials I am guessing it is for the 'what if the company goes under' question. The answer is different between a policy and a certificate. When I wrote my mom and brother I wrote them United Heritage FE. They were not the cheapest. This was before the last rate increase. Both claims were paid in 48 hours of death.
$25,000 limits what companies you use. Depression and arthritis can go from Std to decline on FU. I would be quoting FE as well. With Covid protocols I am seeing a lot more APSs and delays on these small FU policies. Assurity has a participating WL that will write $25,000. With PUA increasing face amount and accelerated death benefit. Ask Todd King if they are in your state.
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Nobleviewinsure
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My only other question would be at what price difference would you start to look from a policy to a certificate? 10%? 20? I know this varies for each producer and is a personal decision I'm just curious where you usually make the switch due to price. Thanks!
All the named above Fraternals have some advantages over regular carriers . Kskj has insanely low rates and aggressive underwriting . RNA’s rates are 10-20% higher than many carriers but they have very aggressive underwriting and no height and weight scale . Gcu has great rates at the younger ages .
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For me
It depends some on the client or the client base I think. If you work the poorest and maybe may less critical thinking population an agent can twist out a policy for $5mo differences. A different client may weigh value over price and gladly pay more. One is not better than the other just different. For the $25,000 size policy +-$10mo may have me looking at the differences. Does the policy have any inherent benefits like ABR, how is the claims and customer service and so on. Ask all these agents what car they drive. They are all agents but you will find pick up trucks to sports cars. American, Japanese and German. Which is the correct one?
Many times I will run an FEX quote filtered to my companies see where my person fits. I will also run a All Companies to see what the competition looks like.
Side note: I have never been a big fan of adding ADB riders outside of specific risk. But I have been getting a lot of requests for quotes lately. So I may start looking at what FE companies offer that and the age restrictions. FEXQUOTES does not offer that feature though.
