Who OWNS Your Leads?

[Newby]

Don't disagree that he's provided helpful info, but it should be seen through the lens of someone using the board for marketing purposes. That's the price of using the board to recruit. Not always objective.

My motive may be a little at pointing out what I see as a huge advantage to my agency. But it's just as much to see if anybody even cares about such things because I could retire early off of saving agents a few bucks on leads, less commissions and then reselling the leads.

It MAY be a perfect system and maybe I'm on the wrong side of it.

 

[moonlightandmargaritas]

My motive may be a little at pointing out what I see as a huge advantage to my agency.

Scott, I think that you are a straight-up, stand-up guy that is an asset to the forum - all I was suggesting is what you posted - you're pointing out what you see as an advantage to doing business with you. Nothing wrong with it - as long as it's disclosed.

 

[dcnagel]

What it comes down too is the company you are getting the leads from. Some companies will tell you that the lead is your and yours forever. However if you are ordering leads from a company that also sells older leads for a cheaper price, then the chances are that the lead is only going to get passed down at a cheaper rate to the next agent who come along. So if one company wants $25 dollars for a fresh lead and also sells 40 day, 90 day, 180 day, 270 day old leads, well guess What!!?? ha! This lead is obviously not going to be yours forever. The broker I'm currently contracted with provides quality leads (telemarketing, direct-mail, and telemarketing with recordings) for excellent rates and the leads are yours for life! We are currently contracting new agent but thats aside the point. The REAL point is that THERE ARE NO SUCH THING AS FRESH LEADS!!! Think about the people to fill out direct mail. What are realistically the chances that you receive the VERY FIRST mailer that they ever sent back. You know the average American buys life insurance a minimum of 7 times throughout their lifetime. Thats a great thing. It keeps many of us with incomes. However, if you catch someone in their 70's, it is highly doubtful that its the first time they mailed in or answered the phone and pressed 1 causing some agent to pay 15 to 30 dollars for a piece of paper with their info on it. To wrap things up, the same reason you will never have a fresh lead is the same reason you have an income. So if you didnt sell them when they were "fresh" whats the chance of that same person keeping the lead and selling them later. Not very likely. So whatever, let them sell them again for a discounted rate and help the world go round for the rest of the industry.

 

[rousemark]

Scott, I think that you are a straight-up, stand-up guy that is an asset to the forum - all I was suggesting is what you posted - you're pointing out what you see as an advantage to doing business with you. Nothing wrong with it - as long as it's disclosed.

Scott was on the board offering good content long before he decided to become an IMO. Haven't seen anywhere in any of this (other than his signature) where he has said, "come contract with me" like a lot of the other recruiters that post here. I take him at his word that the reason for his post was to point out to agents who might be considering them a serious flaw in the way some of the more popular IMOs operate and not to recruit. As far as full disclosure, his signature discloses the fact he is an IMO in every post he makes so he is not trying to hide anything.

 

[GoCubsGo]

Newby is discussing one way of doing business verses another. Buying and owning your leads from a lead vendor or renting them from your IMO. An agent with EFES can buy his own leads and stay with EFES. Doesn't have to switch to Newby and Newby isn't suggesting they do. This discussion could easily have input both for and against each side so I don't see the need for any goofy disclosure just to appease a trouble maker.

This discussion will be very helpful to many agents especially newer ones.

 

[Ryan Caras]

A recent poster posted this:

I have put the door knocking on hold since I bought some Bonus Leads from XYZ Upline (47 of them). Their Bonus leads are leads that have been sold before and are at 90-280 days old. So...there is a little bit of a challenge with them but I've sold two of the leads so far. It is great practice for me at a discount price. I'd rather get the practice for $10 a lead compared to $24.

I'm not bashing the poster for buying the ages leads but should the FMO that already sold the leads once to their agent, be able with a clear conscious to sell it again to the 1st agent's new competitor. The first agent paid full price (or a discounted price with reduced commissions) for the leads. The leads should be owned only by the original agent. HE and only he should be able to sell his leads to a new agent competitor if he wants to. The upline FMO has no cost in these leads at all. If they are allowed to sell them over and over, it's a huge money-maker for them.

I don't think as an FE agent that I ever want ANYONE between my leads and me. I want them direct from the lead vendor. My leads that I pay full price for are mine forever and I will work them again as aged leads.

Am I wrong on this?

I think if you pay for the entire lead yourself then of course it is your lead until the day you retire.

I know for our system we pay between 40-70% of the entire lead cost for our agents and we finance them for 10 days. If i provide leads to agent X who takes 25 leads and sells zero of them everyone in the industry knows there is at least two lay downs in that group of leads they just weren't worked correctly. In this circumstance our company would be in the red because there were no sales made to recoup the subsidized lead cost. So in theory when a new agent comes along in that area we do sell "bonus" leads at a discount to them if they want to practice or if they are on a budget because we know there are sales in those leads that were never sold.

this is just how we handle it... and the economics behind those reasons... its just not apples to apples when comparing a broker mentality to a lead program...

RC

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EFES sells their BONUS/Pre-Worked leads for $3-$12 each and makes it clear to their agents that if you don't make a sale from a lead, that lead will go up for grabs on the website...after 90 days...

these are on a 50% discount for the month of November but these are normally the prices for aged unsold leads

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Here's a call out to Adam (FexQuoting), Crabcake Johnny, Josh (Affordable Lead Lists) and anyone else that has great website chops and makes money off insurance agents...

Here is your MILLION dollar opportunity:

Build a website where any FE agent can easily go on and sell his 90-day old leads for $7, 6-month old leads for $3 and 12-month old leads for $2

Then you make leads available for $10, $6, and $2

Instead of these FMOs making all the resale money and dumping a 2nd agent right on top of the full paying agent, the original agent gets to choose when to resale the UNSOLD leads. HE makes some of his money back.

If the website owner sells 1,000 leads a day he's making good money. Heck the agents will buy in lots of 100 so 1,000 a day should be cake!

Come on guys...do I have to do all your thinking for you. Get er done.

the problem with doing this is the agent buying them doesn't know what they are getting...

what we do with bonus leads is specifically guide the new agent to purchase specific agents that left the program knowing that they didn't sell any of their leads to give them the best shot of writing some business...

unlike some FMO's we are not in the lead selling business to make money we lose money every time we give an agent a lead... so we are at the mercy of the agent being successful just so that we can break even on our investment...

If i sell agent X a lead for 20 dollars and he doesn't sell
and then agent Y buys that lead for 10 dollars when agent X leaves
we would still be in the red if no sale was made on that lead

 

[ccurryUW]

Scott was on the board offering good content long before he decided to become an IMO. Haven't seen anywhere in any of this (other than his signature) where he has said, "come contract with me" like a lot of the other recruiters that post here. I take him at his word that the reason for his post was to point out to agents who might be considering them a serious flaw in the way some of the more popular IMOs operate and not to recruit. As far as full disclosure, his signature discloses the fact he is an IMO in every post he makes so he is not trying to hide anything.

You seem like a smart guy rousemark, you should know the best recruiters don't ever say "come contract with me." It's actually more respectable for someone to post "come contract with me." Least they are being upfront about it. I love reading Newby's posts regardless, I'm just not ignorant to them.

 

[jdeasy]

You seem like a smart guy rousemark, you should know the best recruiters don't ever say "come contract with me." It's actually more respectable for someone to post "come contract with me." Least they are being upfront about it. I love reading Newby's posts regardless, I'm just not ignorant to them.

What?? Newby didn't start contracting until this year and since then he has said it openly.

Before this year he still provided info here when he was not a recruiter.

You should take lessons. You came on here clueless and then started spamming.

You don't even know what "upfront" means.

 

[rousemark]

You seem like a smart guy rousemark, you should know the best recruiters don't ever say "come contract with me." It's actually more respectable for someone to post "come contract with me." Least they are being upfront about it. I love reading Newby's posts regardless, I'm just not ignorant to them.

You open with I "seem like a smart guy" and close with the implication I'm "ignorant"? You speak with forked tongue"..

 

[xrac]

Scott was on the board offering good content long before he decided to become an IMO. Haven't seen anywhere in any of this (other than his signature) where he has said, "come contract with me" like a lot of the other recruiters that post here. I take him at his word that the reason for his post was to point out to agents who might be considering them a serious flaw in the way some of the more popular IMOs operate and not to recruit. As far as full disclosure, his signature discloses the fact he is an IMO in every post he makes so he is not trying to hide anything.

Louis is correct and you will not get any traction on this forum by criticizing Scott (Newby). He has been a participant for a long time and a very valued contributor.